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Go back to a spirited debate you know -- -- some Bailey -- was really doing her job as an authentic Catholic and Christian the whole mandate crisis probably wouldn't have occurred.
I'll -- the claim -- -- Kevin Lowery who's who writes a lot on what it means to win once made at working Kevin's book probably we call.
Faith at work finding purpose beyond the paycheck.
There it is and -- Kevin joins me now via Skype.
Welcome Gavin thank you lord is to be here you know -- think about it but because are you saying that.
-- presents an opportunity for people actually live out their craven and when they think of it that way the whole.
Understanding of their job changes.
Yeah I think that's exactly right if we take.
The view there really we come to work and we share our faith in the door I think we're losing out on probably one of the biggest opportunities that we have.
Because when we bring phase two workers were really focused on living the virtues.
In a way that I think can be very profound and what I believe is -- by being more faithful.
In the workplace I'm not speaking about proselytizing or beating anybody over the head with a Bible.
It's simply living as Catholics you know forgiving other people.
Being -- be lying even when there is -- no reason to making sure that service is more important to us and simply making mind.
All these different aspects of our faith and -- -- perfect can be brought to bear in the workplace in a way that makes us better workers.
And I think by becoming better workers that also is sort of mutually complementary.
With our faith and actually makes -- more -- You know one of the back to the Kathleen Sebelius -- about she is the as secretary of -- health and human services and about this health care mandates and a bit.
That requires that employers provide contraception.
Regardless of the religious beliefs now.
You're saying that if she really -- a good Catholic this would not be an issue -- as Sally you're -- Well you know it's interesting because I think if she were good Catholic should probably wouldn't -- gotten the job in the first place.
But even now what what I think is that we are all called to conversion.
On a continuous basis meaning to -- work we're called to essentially secure out.
Who god is union truth not simply conforming to insult to -- our vision of what god is.
Is sort of along the lines of the previous -- listen all the people -- and figure out.
They're telling us in terms of what the -- should do.
I don't think that's the game at all.
I think it really especially in this case Kathleen Sebelius.
Ended the all the rest of us for that matter -- -- to examine our own lives and then try to figure out what god calls us.
And that's the beauty of being -- you know I love being Catholic and I -- -- -- to the -- My dad was actually a minister.
Who we end up Protestant church for many many years as I grew up and in fact I think that your former guest would have -- comparable in his congregation.
Because there was you know a lot of room for interpretation you can basically make make your vision of christianity -- -- you wanted to.
That's not the case with being Catholic.
Being Catholic really sets us up so that it's up to us to try to conform ourselves to the city.
Good ways that this this isn't all bad I mean we talk about contraceptives and I think it's a teachable moment right now.
Because I've been on both sides -- even as a married man contraceptives just get in the way great sex you know I have eight kids and it's not because we didn't use contraception.
Is because of the fact that we we came to value and appreciate children.
In a way that that their blessings and not just economic liabilities.
So to me having this objective basis and in this consistency of darker and there was utterly compelling but -- -- like the -- You're making a really good point about Kathleen Sebelius and for all people is that is they have to.
It it it it.
They if they can't check their religion at the door sort of so to speak sometimes a job will be closed to them.
You know this just the way it is and so we kind of witnesses -- it says.
Everybody is -- practice their religion but just keep it to yourself I mean how does a person great -- sort of balance those two.
Well and I think that right now the way we're going on macro basis is very sinister because with the if you -- take this to his natural conclusion.
It becomes totalitarian.
So whoever has power gets to say here's what you -- and if you don't choose to believe it then you're in big trouble.
And right now if we don't all through this trajectory that -- Were -- serious danger of of having to shut down.
Catholic hospitals and social service agencies these these -- to do an enormous amount of good for our community -- for our -- Ended.
You know just because they won't go along which the the politically correct sense that that you have to be in favor of abortion rights or something like that.
This is why specifically the church has a target it on its back.
Because it's not like Pope Benedict is gonna wake up tomorrow morning and say you know what I we've been wrong this whole last 2000 years and a and we misinterpret what Jesus said.
Really he's cool with abortion that's great let's let's do that you don't solicit encourage -- women to get abortions not gonna happen.
And that's why Catholics I think now are coming -- under such scrutiny but it's an invitation -- an invitation to Christian unity.
And it's an invitation to be thoroughly conformed to the gospel of Jesus Christ as has been faithfully passed down through the -- Getting your talking about -- your book losing -- faith at work you know we're talking of the yet putting money.
A accrual at the top of -- -- that's what causes the problems is that faith that work finding purpose beyond the paycheck are used to people that they should they should be.
Unsatisfied with taking a lower paying job or not even a job sort of in there.
If an end in their career -- You know in order to basically live out their -- better.
Well I see I see I see our work is sort of -- -- several occasions it is not the essence of our locations but it's part of what we do.
As are calling and I actually left corporate big corporate job a couple of years back.
And went with a lower paying job or Catholic nonprofit I love it I think it's fantastic and it's because the fact that I'm doing what I -- -- called in to do.
So that -- -- can be great satisfaction at what I'm saying is money should not be the most important thing it's important but you know again I'm getting kids.
I pay bills you know I've got those issues.
But I think it's very very important that we would that we -- it really gets Christian service its service to others in -- responding to -- hall.
As part of her location they're really matters -- ultimately give us the greatest sense of satisfaction because we won't get that from just mind.
In order your club also -- the relationships and how they're handled are the key to success explain that.
Yeah I think your relationships in the workplace works are always.
Are going to be a challenge because you're gonna have a wide assortment of people now.
I think personally that's a huge advantage today you know I -- in -- home I -- Canadian effect to this day.
And my dad taught an international MBA program when I was young and we were period blessed to have people from all over the world at our house on a regular basis.
And that was a terrific experience and my.
Experience in the workplace suggests that when you bring a diverse the bunch of people.
To a particular problem in terms of the way of thinking and opened the backgrounds that they bring to a problem you're gonna come out there with a better solution.
But at the same time you're gonna have conflict it's inevitable.
So if we take the tools of our faith and we then apply it to those relationships and treat others as Christ treated people.
Then I think it just puts a whole new.
Flavor on the whole thing and again I think it helps us to be more effective.
Our employers should be thrilled about this sort of thing and -- the same time it really does help us to be faithful.
And it's doesn't have to be in a way where were always -- -- -- I think it's much more convincing if we're living it.
First and and you know talking about I don't think should be outlawed by any stretch but that's secondary it's living at first.
Well that's what a wonderful I -- -- the book is called -- at work.
Finding purpose beyond the paycheck Kevin Lowery is the author I thank you so much for being on a spirited debate here.
Thanks for sitting down talking with me.
Thank you -- really appreciate the opportunity.
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