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Watch the ‘FOX News Sunday' panel, Bill Kristol, Charles Lane, Liz Cheney and Mara Liasson, as they discuss the Wisconsin recall and California ball...
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And welcome to FOX News Sunday panel plots with Bill Kristol Charles -- Liz Cheney -- Mara Liasson.
And we're gonna talk about what we talked about the first half of the programme with our gas and not as the the impact of this week's votes -- Wisconsin recall election in which was -- Governor Walker was able to beat it back and also.
The very existing vote in San Diego and San Jose California.
Where voters by overwhelming margins San Jose 70% voted to -- Government pensions because services are being so.
Squeezed there.
Significance watershed what do you think as the message -- I think significant you can always go wrong trying to generalize from.
You know special elections and local elections but.
Look the big question for 2012 when supporters think about it is does this go to early 2008 when President Obama and the Democrats won by seven points nationally.
We're 2010 when the Republicans won by about seven points nationally.
And Wisconsin looked funny twelve looks an awful lot like Wisconsin's when he found walker actually -- -- -- -- -- point and I do think San Jose and San Diego suggest that the spirit of the Tea Party.
In the sense of the problem is big government to government that's too big.
Public sector pensions that have been in prominently granted by public officials and that needs to be curve that that spirit is alive and well it's -- it's well.
You know and he.
I get a lot of research for this -- when I learned a lot of things I didn't -- -- San Jose is such an instinct case democratic mayor.
But he supported this voter initiative and it -- as I said with 70% of the vote Charles and and one of the reasons it did in this is to cut back on the government worker pensions.
They have fire stations they had to do a rotation on the fire station they couldn't keep them all open all the time commitment of the money they had built four brand new libraries.
And they couldn't open them because I didn't have the money so you can understand where voters.
A lot of them don't have nearly as generous or any pensions or health care plans are sitting there saying and we're gonna pay our taxes to them when we can have -- libraries open.
You know this has been an issue for a long time that the events Wisconsin California this week in the first time -- ever crystallized in the form of real votes in real elections that really counted for something and that's.
Why it it gives such a strong signal cause you can't -- can't deny these results.
And as you point out I think one of the very interest in consequences that deserves more attention is the division with -- the Democratic Party that this starts to.
Develop where you have office holders like that -- you mentioned just have to pay the bills you know and they're worried about that.
Coming into conflict with the unions who are the base everywhere our governor of California yes but he's been very ineffective in in that but I mean he's also -- -- that yes Andrew Cuomo has tried to play it within the party.
And you know this plays out in many ways the divisions within the party about how much the president should have help how much it did help etc.
what's good idea to go down this road.
In other words I think some Democrats are starting to reconsider.
This -- this alliance with the public sector unions.
It's quite unclear how that reconsideration will wind up I think it's begun.
It's not just -- a decision.
Within the Democratic Party it's also a division within the union movement and we saw those -- -- polls in Wisconsin which showed in union.
Households either you're a member of the union nor.
-- your spouse or somebody in your family is a member of the union more than a third of the voters went for walker and I be you gotta figure a lot of them are -- -- I don't get these benefits and then I have to pay taxes which allow the government workers to get benefits I don't have.
And I think that that that division is isn't dangerous for the unions.
I think the other thing that's dangerous for the success in the future of the unions is -- -- Charles Krauthammer wrote about this week which is that.
In Indiana for example where governor Daniels ended the mandatory the government itself taking -- -- at a union members' paychecks.
The union public sector unions last 90% and its membership.
And Wisconsin you've -- 50%.
Of the asked me union membership gone now people are given a choice.
The anything that I think is key here for the unions is you know as Republicans we have for a long time looked on these unions it in honor of their political skill and their political organization and their grassroots efforts.
And Wisconsin showed that we can as Republicans in fact overcome that.
I think there you've got Wisconsin is as you know sort of Karl Rove is called a call to action but it shows what's got to be done in November in terms of -- more than -- time people to get to the polls but really getting out at a grassroots level.
You know knocking on doors driving -- -- the polls make in the phone.
Let me ask you about that this -- and and bring in -- because at least the perception has now Wisconsin's special case -- -- -- mobilized.
The perception is that the Obama team has a much better.
Field ground game than the Romney team does at least so far they've been building it for two years.
Yeah it's -- -- -- for the conventional wisdom but you know the conventional wisdom has also been that the Obama team you know finance operation is more effective than governor Romney showed this last month that he was able to out raise them so.
I think it's not a bad place for Republicans to -- to make sure that we understand what a portable machine this isn't gonna -- back.
-- Wisconsin shows as a path toward a way to victory for Republicans mark.
No doubt huge victory for Republicans but don't forget Scott -- outspent his opponent by seven to one and the vast majority of his money came from out of state in big unlimited contributions that's -- structural advantage that Republicans have this year all over the country because of Citizens United.
Just to pick up on charles' point I don't think the Democrats are rethinking their alliance with the public sector unions.
Public sector unions are pretty much all they've got now now that you've got corporations being able to -- Republicans.
You know and in these huge amounts what they are rethinking is the actual fiscal drag on on the on the country and municipalities that's what's happening.
In Wisconsin the public sector unions that will give you -- the fiscal give back will will take the hit we just want our collective bargaining rights being maintained.
That's where the real power struggle is about if you do in Indiana's Mitch Daniels did.
And -- get rid of collective bargaining rights.
And paycheck deductions as closed as mentioned -- -- joining a public sector union you're gonna -- out the biggest opponent that Republicans have had.
The biggest counter weight that the Democrats have relied on I think this is kind of a fundamental re calibration of political power.
Public sector unions are gonna -- there just like the private sector unions have over many many years.
And I think this is say you know a harbinger of things to come Republicans have a a lot of structural advantages.
You -- -- make one -- them with just I think.
Democratic governors like Cuomo and Governor Brown recovered quote New York Governor -- California rethinking democratic mayor I'm thinking running right out of there are we expecting the -- -- -- how to restructure the hook and -- witch and who isn't free thinking yeah.
Barack Obama -- that is what was striking about the press conference on Friday in the and the radio address and it if Bill Clinton for president I think he would have associated himself.
With the mayor of San Jose and -- unless I -- something that Barack Obama placed a congratulatory phone call to.
To the -- -- as -- as a Democrat and say hey way to go to really make sensible form at the local level so I think it is a problem.
For President Obama that he is not he isn't really and he's not presenting himself as.
A kind of new Democrat I'm being very laissez Faire -- -- quickly.
-- just quickly I mean there has been a lot of talk about the secular shift toward Democrats -- demography the rising Hispanic population center Amare put your finger on the one thinking Republicans could do.
To sort of -- the balance the other way which is to erode this public sector -- Iraq.
We're gonna leave it there thank you wall.
Opt please let us know what you think about the significance of Wisconsin both in terms what happened this week and what it means for that it.
Strength of the two parties going forward towards November 2 with us throughout the week.
But for my Monday edition of Wallace unplug what you can find right here at FOX News Sunday dot com.
We'll see you back here next.
Yeah.
