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-- all respect to.
-- -- -- -- He says there's hostility between us I don't feel that you know I understand he's asking questions and try to respond as best I can't.
How much -- hospital are pretty calm -- can't -- you know.
And we are calm and we are OK you plunge back into the foxhole I'm still James Rosen I'm still -- -- Twitter after.
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You just heard attorney general Eric Holder embroiled in still another controversy as modern attorneys general tend to be this is the fast and furious scandal.
By way of background operation fast and furious was a gun walking operation in which law enforcement agents several years ago down by the border with Mexico.
Decided to allow roughly 2000 guns to -- south of the border to the Mexican drug cartels with the -- of tracing the guns.
Directly to the bad guys and thereby taking down the narco terrorists but some.
300 of the guns went missing.
Two were ultimately found -- the murder scene O'Brien Terry.
The US Border Patrol agent killed.
In December 2010 attorney general holder and his aides have testified before congress that they did not approve or no terribly much about how fast and furious.
They have also admitted to having provided false data to congress and last month the house.
Voted to hold attorney general holder.
In contempt of congress for failing to turn over additional documents President Obama cited executive privilege to shield those documents.
With us now is Katie -- -- of town hall dot com author of fast and furious Barack -- bloodiest scandal.
And the shameless cover published by -- she tweets from.
Katie -- which thank you for joining us -- first ball was live rough summary of the things accurate in your view there is.
I -- -- the one thing I would change and I think he introduced a beautifully but there are 14100 guns that are still missing.
I'm not 300 and so that's pretty big number that are either lost in Mexico or in the United States -- In basic terms firfer viewers who may just be paying attention to this for the first time haven't followed the Byzantine.
Paper trail so forth -- you trail.
What was the mission of fast and furious.
Well there's -- mission of the governor claimed with the mission of what.
Was they had this idea that they're gonna last straw purchasers now straw purchaser is someone who goes into a gun dealership and legally.
Why well they've made it's and it's called illegal -- what -- -- on the storm.
And they're basically people who go buy guns for criminals are people who can't buy guns in this case struck purchasers were working for the Mexican cartel.
The government's idea was it would allow shoppers are -- -- By these AK forty -- allow them to be transferred to these cartel members in an effort to Trace them across the border.
Well they spread first to admit that they they claimed it first that -- never intended to allow these guns are going to Mexico here enough evidence further down the road.
Proved that to be not the case.
-- so their whole idea was to Tracy is guns into this cartel to what ATF officials and DOJ officials.
Sad would be to take on the big fish to take to cut the head off of the snake in order to dismantle the entire cartel -- okay the our problem though is they -- -- the tracing program.
The problem is -- 12500.
Weapons that were trafficked across the border into Mexico.
Only two of them had GPS recording devices.
So the only way that they -- traceable as if they were found violent crime scenes south of the border and actually left the had a -- where do you get those those numbers from.
From whistle blower testimony from ATF dot.
It's been cited over and over again in the congressional record that -- and the number that's I didn't the most since 2000.
But he actually go back into that the details of the meeting -- it was more 2500.
What's the numbers determined in advance -- that's just the number of guns that accumulated in the sort of hap hazard fashion.
-- -- the exact answers that question I think that's the bottom line is the reason this whole thing that blew out of actually came to the surface was because Border Patrol agent Brian Terry was killed.
And two of the gun -- is crime -- -- part of this operation now if we'll come back to agent -- -- but I but I need that background for but I'm not just say is that I don't think if he was -- that that the kind of slowing would have stopped I think had there been more guns going in -- -- -- so to answer a question of whether there was a -- number.
I'm not sure.
It's safe to assume that there were guns flowing into Mexico all the time regardless of whether or not DOJ or ATF -- engage in -- practice on the -- correct I mean.
Well this is where things get a little murky US another subject with -- which is ATF trees out of from.
Mexico and the claims that are made by Mexico and officials the United States that guns are.
Flowing at a rapid rate from gun shops in the United States to the Mexican cartels well.
That's actually not completely accurate the state department's -- cable show that.
These cartels aren't necessarily getting their guns United States where there's actually regulation is expensive they're getting -- from.
China for getting -- from Central America.
The guns that are being traced back to United States are actually in the most for the most part transferred through.
Contracts to Mexican police stations and Mexican army through the State Department and then those guns -- then walked off by defectors and taken with them.
We have about ninety seconds left in this segment -- it one of your pet peeves is that the most frequently used word to describe operation fast and furious in the news media is the word botched it almost always precedes the words operation fast and -- right.
You say was not.
Botched one because when you say the word caution makes it seem like.
The flow of thousands of guns south was a mistake that somehow accidentally these guns -- it up in the wrong hands -- Actually the program was designed to put a guns into the hands of these -- a little while into ghosts I it was -- in the in the sense that it their efforts have been traced the guns went over to -- correct not if you look at the evidence that shows they never had any.
Plans in place to Trace them in the first place all right stay right.
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