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Awarding winning journalist Bill Gildea sits down with Brian to discuss his new book,'The longest fight: In the ring with Joe Gans, boxing's first Afr...
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He's bill Gil de he wrote the book called the longest fight.
In the ring with Joseph Ganz boxing's finest African American champion -- they should say.
African American champion nominally -- added that if we -- finest.
And those also covered Olympics dating back to 72.
We'll discuss that did bill congratulations on the book is excellent thanks -- first -- you go and I know Jack Johnson.
I don't Joseph Louis.
What's this guy Joseph -- how do you describe -- brought to the sport and what he did.
Hands as a little moon and I think the reason he is because Jack Johnson followed soon.
Closely.
After after dance Indians didn't live past 1910 so.
People's attention centered.
On Owen Johnson.
And they quickly forgot about -- there were instances.
In which different people thought -- -- for example Hemingway as a high schooler -- Afghans Paul Muni play -- -- in the movies.
Many many boxers.
I -- sixty seminary.
Took it took the name Joseph Ganz who wanted to beat Joseph game ends but their record invariably was one -- two -- two and three -- three into an inning got out of because you know getting hit -- it wasn't too much fun.
And with the exception of just says few people.
And a few people boxers who knew their history.
Like Archie Moore and Mike Tyson.
Stands dropped totally from sites -- use somebody by USU -- the first African American.
Boxing chairs and -- she probably would say Jack Johnson and you would be with about 99%.
Of the people.
You go to the you go to.
Washington.
And you see this fight and you see him fight against a guy with -- when the great nicknames.
Battling Nelson.
And and you watch this you know the fight is over three hours but what sold you on this -- that you had to write this story.
Well.
First off.
He was he was from Baltimore I was from -- more so that led me to -- When -- a guide to The Library of Congress where I did a lot of research but it.
-- ice I I worked for about six months in one particular building.
Screwing up the courage to go to the main building.
And when I went to them -- building almost on the first day.
I found a man who was a boxing aficionado.
And he said -- you think.
There is some footage.
Of DNC and Nelson.
Back in the building where it was and sure enough there it was then there were two huge -- -- A film all film but it was it was surprisingly good.
And I watched it and from their point in new that I had to do to fight the fight is -- I -- I can say this one thing.
The there wasn't the first vice owned the first fight -- -- the figures were so small and knew that they were very barely -- born in this.
This occasion only one camera was used -- was moved forward.
And you could see everything in and what surprised me you're the biggest surprise -- so modern as we would say today how modern and a fighter -- was.
Any thought you know he eat a study Corbin -- steady Fitzsimmons in these guys are -- -- boxing just fight it was a brawling.
And who -- science to -- the sweet science and he brings that to it.
But also -- the person growing up in America as an African American in 1890s.
In in 19100.
Wasn't much fun but -- there's something about him that -- -- people liked him why.
I think Americans have always been fair and once they saw him and his behavior in the ring.
That appeal to them he was always -- abide by the rules.
And he learned one thing Willie learned many things Romo Fitzsimmons the one thing you did learn was.
To pick up his opponent when he knocked opponent down and -- deduce.
To Nelson with Nelson twice it was a racist yes absolutely by.
You know -- was a a -- mannered guy which certainly didn't help blow promote him.
Through years.
And you know he didn't care he was in competition.
-- with Nelson and he he picked him up twice.
Fitzsimmons said it had a history of picking up people's who and Fitzsimmons.
Really was cement -- -- -- The attraction to the sport people -- struggling in this country they're trying to make their way so that kids thought to themselves young men.
I'm gonna fight my way up I'm literally gonna fight -- would have the latter of which is emblematic of what we -- asked to do what America.
Cut your -- -- make your own life.
Well it was an it was -- Italians were in our sport a Jewish board.
Blacks.
Oh were ten and beat him by export -- that it was.
-- -- literally trapped.
In in Baltimore he was.
His Foster mother -- -- work for a lifetime in the fish market.
And but he was a natural and by great good -- He is his boss in the fish market was it was a boxing coach and so he put two guys in the ring.
With can -- became a tremendous defensive fighter.
And and the rest is history he he had -- eight Hawaii manager and the only good thing he came of that because her effort to count her for -- manager took most against his money.
Was affected -- unlike a lot of early black fighters.
Got the flyweight fighters.
Right and that that was key and then they realize he can act like this -- an open the -- for other African American fighters need to get other fights correct.
I think I think I would like to see.
Jackie Robinson and nurtured dance if it's who we could have -- meaning of those two I think they were a lot of -- he septic Jackie had.
There had had more of a temper your he was.
Ready to burst yeah.
Here's the thing to build build daisy guess -- wrote the book called the longest -- In the ring with Joseph Ganz boxing's first African American champion.
And those also been writing for a long time award winning journalist is gonna be talking with the Olympics don't wanna talk about the book for a little while longer.
And first off with this guy he reminds me of a lot of good.
The successful people in -- he doesn't -- his situation he doesn't seem to to complain alive.
He deals with reality he was -- on he was fouled.
He was dealt with a lot -- at the -- he heard the heard the the racist comments -- he dealt with it rather than letting me get him down who overcame it.
He.
He just sort of I in all my researchers sanity he lost it as it were one and one time -- were rising in the barrel with Nelson.
Them because Nelson kicked him -- so he kickback but it was and he -- heaters the moment.
-- would be speculative.
To us to wonder why he would have done had he lived.
He was -- men -- to Jack Johnson.
He knew Jack Johnson well Johnson -- to -- four.
Help.
Strategy.
Tactics.
They discussed all of these things.
Against never saw Jensen fight.
But he can put at the time.
Boxing was a -- Sport and the odds -- fluctuate and you could bad as the fight progressed.
At the time.
A lot of people white people were betting on Jefferies and he warned them not to Barrett on Jeffries just because -- it was -- -- -- Jim Jeffries was a champion got to coax out of retirement to take on Jack Johnson and fight for -- so called white race.
But you know you had two guys and Joseph Ganz -- mild mannered almost like Joseph Louis so much more cerebral Joseph Louis.
And then you have Jack Johnson who was more like mom and -- before there was a mom and LA.
So even though we might be getting his advice when he came to his demeanor outside the -- they couldn't be more opposite correct.
Right the did the mystery.
Of Afghans he is how he became.
Harry had a sense of humor how he.
Was seemingly articulate.
Why is it he was adopted an early age so was it his Foster mother was it Fitzsimmons was it -- a bond.
The man in fish market.
It probably was a combination of those things perhaps -- was from her for himself so.
It's -- we don't know we don't know who his mother was we don't know who he and his thought we we know is who his father was.
But we don't know much of the early games he's certainly did not have a long formal education may be a couple of -- and that was it.
Right oh bill this is tremendous story of -- it's important for people to read and know about this guy.
He actually finds him as I continue to did not as clear is the one you saw at the library -- congress I'm sure.
And it's all in the longest fight we.
