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Well what the presidential election just 67.
Days -- that 66 what -- the American voters are and pundits alike are wondering just how big an impact religion will play out on November 6.
The church seems to be as politically divided as the culture can -- become a shared space.
That's Charles -- takes on that subject in his book body broken.
Can Republicans and Democrats sit in the same pew pastor who is the senior minister at a manual Presbyterian Church in new York and -- now.
Beer -- so so why did you write the book.
I wrote the book.
To answer the question in subtitled that can Republicans and Democrats -- in the -- cute.
And the answer I give is.
It will -- but it will take a lot of work but.
But it's very strategic that they find a way to do it.
And I would be I've -- -- to tell you why that's plants with a street strategic what he means means you have to work.
Well it's -- strategic because.
What the church is supposed to be.
That and if you don't mind and I just read you I've read a passage from with the instructor for real quick passage -- I'm Paul writes in this classic -- about the church -- -- there for a prisoner for the lord urge you to walk.
In a manner worthy of the calling to which you've been called with all.
Humility and gentleness with patients -- -- one another and love eager to maintain the unity of the spirit.
In the bond of peace there -- one body and one's spirit.
Just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call one lord one faith one baptism one gun violent assault.
And all that talk about one illness goes factories -- little -- -- -- two parties yeah I got -- but assignment the church right after just you know churches one.
And then he goes back in -- it it in that same book to chapter two recess.
The basis of this bluntness is it Christ is our peace who has made us both one has broken down.
In his lesson dividing -- of hostility by abolishing the law -- command that's important is that you might create himself one.
Knew right and out of the two.
-- -- this this would require that Christian or religious people actually.
You know read scripture and we've scripture and attend services regularly in all the polls show that among you know people who were sort of you know occasional churchgoers that you intend to go more democratic -- people were -- different colors.
And they tended to go Republican right -- 11 very very good example is that you had with forty years ago.
The -- reporter for the Catholics for the Democratic Party admit anything else that it was just the Democrats right and then I'll.
That's not the case you've got a real split between the Catholic vote at the growth it is now that.
You know so goes the Catholic so goes the nation and they're really starting to sort of splinter -- has the culture change or as the -- what's changed well.
I don't know but what I do.
No incidents that that.
As a as a pastor I urge my people I urged church in this book.
To -- very very serious about their biblical orientation because they need to wrestle with.
What in fact the scripture says they are that there is -- unity.
Political unity it ought to.
And given those passages that I read to you if if the church can't find a way.
To agree to back to stay together even when they discriminate saying there are disagreements of course their disagreements there there are deep -- that the church can't find a way.
To be one what it.
Proves quote -- to the world.
Is that Christ is not much of a savior that his cross didn't really committee can.
And Paulson did -- chapter -- and it also proves that Jesus can't.
-- very well because.
Because he praising -- seventeen that the church may find a way.
To be want justice he and his father are.
What -- so it's it's very strategic.
But hard but you know -- but what examples of it because in your book you ask the you say in it to hate evil you have a section of -- -- hate evil.
But the question is how do you define evil because that really becomes an issue of that's behind the issue I mean -- talked about -- to those who.
Who call evil good and good people and so now how we define evil because I think everybody agrees yet -- hate evil and but what you call.
-- Yang and yet -- but -- a wonderful question.
I think another reason why we disagree with each other.
Is is that we really care.
And are caring is a function.
Of art is effort to define what in fact evil is it if if Christian if Christians thought.
That that the only thing that Jesus who is allegedly the lord of everything cared about.
Where is our private lives where we -- just taking care of our own personal issues.
Then we wouldn't be.
Facing this question of how to -- I love my neighbors myself.
And we wouldn't and thereby.
I'm having this.
Problem of caring parent because were asking about caring having to define.
What in fact.
Evil and good.
Really it doesn't have a question about is this really an issue -- -- People getting deeper -- the faith or is this an issue of a generation gap and I got down.
Because here you've got a situation where and on many young evangelicals and young you know people think -- -- its first.
We're very much.
46 -- -- but you know a court.
And this these -- used to do lockstep.
Right and right but among a younger generation.
They are in house would not sure sure I I think Annie get racial divides I think you've got gender divides I think you've got age span divides and so and so forth.
It it can wait can I say something a little bit about up.
Some distinctions that I didn't found helpful.
-- I I try to navigate situation in my church where I've got people who -- Republicans and Democrats and where we're conservative true -- logically.
And so how to what help them do that across these many different device Internet cash -- that it -- -- it I have.
-- -- three distinctions that I found very helpful to make as I try to steer my people through this business of really care.
Working on defining evil on the one hand.
But somehow finding a way.
To stay together because the church is the one organization is going to outlast the into the world.
There's no other organization that's the only social organizations gonna last so we have to try to find a way to do so hit here my priest three.
That the suggested.
Contract not contracts but -- distinctions.
One between theocracy and influence.
A second is between moral principle and political strategy and I think that's a very practical one.
And the third is between.
Calling the calling of the church as the church.
And Nicole and individuals.
In their effort to follow Christ and -- -- might not just kind of -- those out for you within a wee bit if that's right.
The distinction reaching theocracy and influence it's a tricky when but it's a very importantly.
Thank -- so I wanna get to a quick question yeah a number of viewers because they -- -- attention and Barbara Giuliani is she says that's not.
And yet mayor it's an offensive consistency -- yeah led to Chris want to understand others who think differently than they do because what you're talking non Christians you've got.
It is not everyone America's -- sent me and I I.
That's a great question and I I think the answer depends -- you're talking to the one of the sad things is I don't think they do.
There's a great.
There's -- or enough I don't think you do it enough packet there's -- there's a great -- statement got the good lord gave us two ears and one mouth so that would listen twice as much as we speak.
And and we don't listen very well and waterways that shows up interestingly.
Is the churches and one of the reasons churches in our time don't blow up isn't already divided on political you've got the episcopal church dividing you've -- -- -- Brothers and every mainline Protestant church.
Seems to have gone their separate ways that based -- their you know liberal or conservative views right right -- your your your your standard.
You're standard fiscal your your standard.
African American church will -- to Democrat is standard suburban white church will tend to be Republican -- that -- is very interesting to say that because despite.
President Obama -- stance forcing six months what most African American efforts are actually against ranked 91 person about Americans still favor.
President Obama -- regardless anyways let me I I really -- at time refresh your bit I would just say this spam.
-- distinction -- -- very very helpful is between political and moral principle and political strategy.
The church needs to articulate unabashedly.
High moral principles like don't kill that has an effect upon abortion okay.
Strategy has to do with the question of how you nudge the culture.
In the direction of greater conformity to that it to that high moral principle.
The moment you move from high moral principles of political strategy like.
How do you vote for example for their church has an additional obligation to protect.
The consciences and its people not only from the outside world.
But from each other.
You know at Saddam is a difficult prospect because it's one thing to have it in theory that they got and practice them which is why we have such political list as we do -- at the why we have these debates is as much as we can and I'm glad you and I want to thank you very much Charles drew -- the by the book is called body broken.
-- Republican and Democrats sit in the same pew.
Thank you very much for being here very happy to be here thank you for having me.
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