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Power Play 12/13/2012

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    Fiscal talks spark feud over whether to spend Christmas in Washington or home. Join the live chat

  • Duration 27:10
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No matter.

And backs.

-- Franklin Delano Roosevelt he was a Democrat and he had to be present the United States elected four times stuff too shabby.

And this is power play.

And I'm Chris Farrell so why Internet -- today well apartment fiscal cliff cliff cliff cliff cliff this that the other thing about the -- -- cliff.

Why do I show you Franklin Roosevelt because conservatives in America.

Have come to believe that really the truth about their government is that it's only been going one direction.

Since the days of the group new deal and frank Roosevelt.

So one of the smartest man of the right.

Has explore the question and it is particularly timely right now as.

Republicans battle to try to get spending cuts or reductions in future increases in spending.

Is Michael Barone.

Has written a new book on the subject about Michael Brown who is.

Other then the guy who.

Helped us be the first call the state of Ohio on election night.

The Fox News decision desk aside from that which we are very happy about.

And being right was really good.

Aside from that Michael is of course -- senior political analyst for the Washington examiner.

And he is -- from your fellow.

Resident Scott a resident fellow resident fellow he is a fine fellow resident fellow at the American Enterprise Institute.

It is through the auspices -- he's also by the way the deep principle player in the almanac of American politics.

But it is through the offices of the American Enterprise Institute did you have a new book -- you e-book.

That talks about this question can government actually be rolled back and as we look at the debate that's going on in Washington right now you see.

That wasn't the Republicans are really talking about isn't cutting government or reducing.

It's function what they're asking for are less growth in the future are.

That's right and they're looking at the entitlement programs Social Security Medicare Medicaid and Obama -- Because those are on a trajectory to.

You know increase as a percentage of the gross domestic product far higher than we've ever been able to get in revenues from the American people.

Even -- World War II so.

That's a problem beyond this this e-book it's available on the -- website HEI dot org you can downloaded.

It's available in Kindle form for 99 cents a real bargain.

I wanted to provide an alternative narrative to American history which show.

You know both liberals and conservatives have.

Basically constructed an area where you know usually a Democrat or liberal comes and increases government Republican or conservative was even then it ratchets up again never ratchets down.

I think history -- more complicated than that so when I decided to do was to take a look at.

Elections over the last century.

In which the government policies have been or arguably have been repudiated.

And see what the public policy consequences -- What happens as a result of those elections 19201938194619661980.

1994.

In the answer came up with is yes big government sometimes is rolled back but it takes -- -- it takes considerable amount of preparation.

In policy planning and having policy ideas and really execute takes perseverance it takes good personnel.

Ended he takes a suspicious circumstances sometimes big government has been rolled back in significant ways other times not -- and nineteen Franklin Roosevelt -- That a picture we started off with in this.

Episode of power play is did -- example after he -- his death in 1946 the Republicans won a big victory in.

In -- big margins in both houses of congress.

And they had considerable success.

In coalition with -- conservative Democrats mean we've been an entirely from the south.

In rolling back big government policies.

They cut taxes very substantially.

They got rid of wartime wage and price controls.

Spending went way down of course part of that was a consequence of no longer be involved in the world war both world wars increased the size of government.

They got they changed the law that we're government was -- organization of labor unions were they were essentially allies of the Democratic Party.

With the Taft Hartley act that was passed over president Truman's veto with a two thirds vote in both houses -- you.

Actually -- right now because.

One of the consequences of that -- right to work laws.

Across the country -- Ortiz he allowed states to adopt right to work laws -- we now have you last week the 24 state my home state of Michigan your mind native state of Michigan.

Has done this in this in this just to give us.

And I wanna close on the discussion of what your -- -- about the future but I wanted to get your take for the Internet there's the real consequence of Michigan becoming a right to work day.

Well I think it's.

It's a harbinger that that do -- what may come that basically private sector unionism.

Is on the decline is -- is in fast decline.

Again you know -- in some ways I think the travails.

Of the Big Three unionized auto companies are.

-- lesson that ever serial Unionists and doesn't work very well.

-- -- the way you're actively and in particular because the United Auto Workers was has been run.

For many many years by very Smart people very principled people that a big aversion to corruption of the sort of thing that you've seen the Teamsters union and other unions that's not.

Been a part of the UAW.

It's a kind of best case.

For private sector unionism and yet.

In fact having an adversarial process they're having 5000 pages or whatever it is -- work rules having.

Prevents the kind of flexible management that has worked well for the non unionized auto companies in the United States.

We've had a pretty clear test case and this doesn't work well it's also significant that -- cutting off.

The automatic flow of -- the union dues for us to putt from public -- from public employees Democrats that are you in Michigan probably don't know -- -- public employee unions operate is a subsidy to taxpayer subsidy of the Democratic Party.

And governor Rick Snyder in the Republican legislators in Michigan and said actually we don't -- taxpayer subsidy of the -- Party we.

Second that would be less good the all right so the lesson.

Your book.

For Republicans what this in -- -- I want you Internet to go read Michael's book and look at places as -- whereas in 99 cents I don't know what that is for word that's got to be a great value.

Can read it in the course of an evening I mean I've got some the politically colorful characters in there he's got a few little good stories.

And you know it's.

It's a different an alternative way of looking at American history over the last hundred years it's always good to roll around alternative histories in your mind what's the lesson for Republicans as they are engaged in this current fight with Obama.

Well the lesson is be prepared.

-- have serious policy alternatives.

Persevere.

I think that you know at least so far we are not seen the kind of negotiation and cooperation that we got from Bill Clinton -- -- between Bill Clinton and Newt Gingrich after the 1994.

Election.

My belief is that President Obama is not interested in.

That kind of negotiation and results that President Clinton turned out to -- interest -- that.

But remember those were also pretty tough negotiations of perseverance preparation.

And good personnel.

Michael -- -- even obliterates when he drops knowledge on you Internet Michael we thank you very much and I would urge you.

To go you can go to HEI dot work -- or you can get it on Amazon for your Kindle can't big government be rolled back and broke his interview pertinent question of the day so we thank you won't.

Now look Internet we've got to take a break but when we come back we're going to have a cavalcade of -- for you.

-- editor from the Wall Street Journal will be here to tell Republicans should quit being such -- east Charlie Rangel congressman from Harlem will be here to tell Republicans to get over themselves.

And then we'll also have a super and it's going to be a great show you're going to enjoy it.

-- stick around.

I remains the most optimistic person in this down.

But we've got some serious differences.

And that was -- house speaker John Boehner talking yesterday sounding he said I don't sound optimistic but I swear there is optimism in my heart.

That a big deal -- it's -- news in trillions of dollars can be made at the precipice of the fiscal cliff.

This is power play and every day.

This speaker has to go out and say.

He's working so gosh -- hard.

And they're gonna get a big deal with the Republicans are gonna do something but he is growing increasingly frustrated with the president and people are starting to wonder.

And is cliff jumper -- Ahead.

Well somebody who is a bit.

Fed up with all of this Republican and -- There's -- -- manager he is in fact the deputy editorial page editor for the Wall Street Journal and he is also the author of one of the very smartest columns on politics.

Wonderland every Thursday in the Wall Street Journal they welcome back -- occurrence.

So you have some tough medicine for the Republicans today your -- your -- -- different -- smacking them about the head and shoulders.

Well -- -- basically I'm telling them to stop playing beltway small ball and try to give the American people some sense of why they are resisting President Obama.

I think anyone who's watching this is obviously the American people are becoming more frustrated because they don't really understand what's going on.

This is part of the nature of these sorts of negotiations it's hard to avoid.

But it seemed to me Chris that the fiscal -- Household word every word America now would give the Republicans an opportunity to stand up and explain in larger terms.

Why they are resist the what are the principles beneath the opposition from.

Barack Obama right now.

They're simply not providing any one with the big picture.

In all this and I think the issue is the size of government.

And they've had people such as Mitch Daniels -- spoken about this.

John Boehner himself Lester gave a terrific speech at the economic club of New York on taxes and spending.

And you just don't feel that sense of purpose coming out of the Republican leadership right now.

So it's hard though after you -- that they did loses them rather consequential election.

And they lost seats where they thought -- -- them in the senate in their house majority is still -- out by historical standards but is eight -- smaller.

It's pretty tough to get the -- -- Well yeah I mean I don't know it's true that they do not have too much leverage right now.

But I still think first that's not an excuse for them to stand up and defend their principles they're letting Barack Obama.

Sort of establish the narrative he's running around the country's re delivering his campaign speech about the middle class.

And John Boehner is looking as always.

I think the party is going to suffer.

If they don't make a larger.

Argument on their own -- and you know in other system such as the British system.

A major opposition leader will goal in stand in the house of commons and deliver a speech explaining why you or why that party is doing what it is doing and that's what I find missing right now they're playing small ball they're not giving the American people any ability -- understand.

Why there are resisting the president on taxes why they're resisting the president on spending what they expected their position to do for the American economy.

Why that safety net should not become the most important thing and American life why there's something larger an American purpose they -- -- inspire the American people.

More than they're doing right now.

So what -- two questions what will happen and what should happen.

Well I think they're going to do I they should hold fast on tax rates I think that's part of the Republican brand and added that the slightest doubt Chris that the Democrats and Barack Obama.

Are trying to get the Republican Party to finally break their commitment not to raise tax rates because once they do that.

They're no different than anybody else -- just part of the beltway game manipulating tax rates to pay for the welfare state.

I think if they insist if I think they should simply pass a bill on the house extending the tax rates as they are now.

Calling for the reduced spending hurt keeping a tax rates low.

And let the president veto that let him take responsibility for.

For the -- economy going forward.

The some Republicans are starting to worry and we will have talked with them and heard from them conservatives in the house caucus.

That that that.

The one defeat the first defeat on the issue of tax rates.

Will be the start of a long retreat for the party through the from the years between now.

In mid terms for those two years.

From a strategic point of view that starting the term -- a concession at a loss sets them up -- -- losses still.

Well I think that's right and I think and again the reason I'm arguing Chris for statement by somebody.

Perhaps I don't know that have to be speaker Boehner could be Eric Cantor could be Paul Ryan it could be someone.

Like Rob Portman in the senate Marco Rubio -- even.

Is that they're being set up they're digging themselves a philosophical.

-- that is -- -- disadvantage every candidate running in 2014.

And I think that the presidential candidate 20s16.

-- it's getting to the point where no one quite understands what the Republican Party stands for that was the big question coming out of that loss in November.

And I just think that fiscal -- Is an opportunity to restate to the American people some of the fundamental core conservative beliefs on taxes on spending it on the economy it should not be that difficult.

For somebody down there to stand up and do that.

OK again and I would encourage everybody to go especially Republicans go read what Dan wrote it.

Wsj.com.

If you do not get the lavish.

Printed version of that doesn't it now seems quaint and a little bit that.

We -- -- and newspapers from the luxury item on the Internet is where we get -- with the newspaper just feels -- -- little luxury item that they actually print out the Internet for.

-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- They don't get much elevation it's a fascinating phenomenon.

Well I lied -- millionaire.

And I'm glad it as a as a long time thinks they Gretchen I'm glad it's still there to stand have a great day thanks for joining -- should talk to Chris.

Internet you know what you think you you think.

A lot of stuff we've asked and you think a lot of stuff about a lot of things but I want to focus for this -- I want to -- -- on something a little more esoteric Christopher -- says this.

It is impossible to manage time you could only prioritize.

I thought I've learned that the best way to prioritize is one or two minutes at a time.

Always ask what the most important thing I need to accomplish in this minute and -- better manage your day.

I'm exhausted just thinking about your day Christopher -- that is an exhaust.

That that is it way over power plays that.

We do it broad strokes here my friend brought.

Broad strokes are survive and advance.

Let us now having survived advance.

And talked to congressman Charlie Rangel he is a Democrat he is represented Harlem.

In other parts of New York City.

Congressman welcome back to the show.

-- -- and Merry Christmas.

Mary -- well -- -- stealth.

And yes I think.

You've got and you you have to situated in your constituents you need a lot of wishes to get through your -- you have a very diverse constituency.

Question congressman.

Let the -- the Republicans do it and what should they be doing.

Well maybe they should recognize election is over.

Republicans have made them -- I didn't ask commitments that -- boy and behind -- a political campaign and what is good for the country.

It's very very difficult for the speak become in this -- when they don't know how to turn around what -- -- is abundantly clear.

-- taxes on the top 2% the rates are going to increase.

How they find ways to say that.

Which should indicate that they believe is good for the economy get -- country I don't know.

But that is what they gonna have to find out because we already did talk about the savings that we will have.

With the spending programs we've demonstrated a lot of it and we got a lot further to go.

But if you go to whole -- to these commitments you made.

-- outside this -- law making -- but under no circumstances.

Will we.

Increased taxes on anyone include new rich it's just not going to -- fortunately.

A lot of Republicans in the house and the senate recognize that is and they coming back to reality.

Congressman you in your years on ways and means you you felt right a lot of tax law.

Going back for a long time.

-- question.

Is this.

Why does it matter to your team whether -- -- they are deduction that reductions.

-- rate increases if the net amount of money was the same.

Why why does it matter.

It doesn't matter because rates is something we rely on voluntary.

Income tax system.

And that means people have to believe.

They truly have to believe that the system -- -- If they start to believe that there's some caught up people have citizens.

That it treated differently and more and fear.

Then there is an inclination to find not Jewish sheets but people who just walk away from their obligations.

Now it is true.

That we can raise a lot of money and lot of revenues by closing the loopholes.

But they should and has to be done that's going to happen anyway.

And -- rates as most people -- said don't bring in a lot of money now but in terms of the equity of the system as it relates to what.

Race.

It just seems to me that those that went from small millionaire -- to big billion issued recognize.

That -- rates after changes -- have fortunes have increased.

Duly noted congressman we are always grateful for your time especially today have a great day.

You have a great holiday.

Indeed we will indeed we -- well we're gonna have great holidays all of them.

And we're gonna continue our Honecker -- Up next as we talk to rule.

A couple of very Smart individuals.

We're going to explain to us Tony welcome -- -- we'll explain to us.

What is really going to happen.

And what is what it's doing to your mind Internet in the minds of all Americans has -- Kinda freaking you out.

So we'll try to get you one -- when we come back.

-- -- -- That is what it looked like with the Ukrainian parliament.

Beat the stuffing out of one another as they were having a dispute.

And evidence that it could be worse Internet it could be worse and this is power play.

Where Republicans and Democrats are mostly.

Sad it's misty crabby and upset that they have not resorted to blows as they did this week in the Ukraine itself.

He cheered be a festive mood Internet this on this -- special additional power play.

-- -- And be cheered for this front -- But he's a partner at -- from a single and -- appropriately enough in the owner of the -- company.

That's a lot of -- there but -- point out we should point out that you were the former top -- for senate Republicans in the speaker of the house who worked on both sides.

Pretty big deal also a -- deal Tony Welch former Press Secretary to the DNC you follow him at T -- because you're Smart and you know what's up Internet.

And Tony what is your firm because he got a double plot that they can.

Wonderful Dewey square -- Dewey square group they're Democrats.

And they help other Democrats do stuff.

OK so question we'll start with you.

Ron I wanna show you the Fox News poll that says.

What do you believe.

America is the effect if the president and congress failed to reach agreement on the fiscal cliff.

Terrible.

It was and GTV.

-- terrible or not that bad you know to -- time when the poll questions are terrible or not that bad.

And 52% of respondents said that it would be terrible for the nation's economy 46% said it would be terrible for their finances.

Washington is freaking people out that in unto itself could cause a recession that -- You're absolutely right in you know what will really.

I think -- end -- causing this deal would be the stock market collapse.

John you stock market -- called -- there's hundreds of employees at the other shoe doesn't balk he'll.

You're going to have these these politicians come out of there.

You know the speaker in a president come out of their comfort zones because right now the American people -- think that that they can still get a deal.

And once that moment happens those last few days before either going to be for the new year they have it.

I think that -- of course.

You're making you really want as friends so might settle my stomach on the -- of fisticuffs.

From the black belt anti quite I think he it'll be you know people who knows how much different okay -- -- Estrada -- -- -- -- at -- -- -- You comfort zones kind of interest I I like that idea because.

Do we have little -- winner of the selection who did that -- the incredible thing won an election -- -- -- his taxes Republicans are holding.

Him jumping.

Make the Balkans in the house understand that they didn't win.

They do that and and that they need to get some wire and -- and -- that's why are you protecting.

Be that bad 2% why can't he passed away the wind -- -- -- -- network -- and everybody.

So why can't you agree to the Senate's plan now.

And and and take that off the table and they know that would impact.

That would impact the idea of recession that would.

Make some people rest easier knowing that we are gonna raise taxes come due January brief rebuttal and then I want you both -- -- Deal or No Deal by the end of the -- problem.

The president's meeting very making your theories or for John Boehner -- this conference because he's not making a deal and and the and the speaker has come forward and 800 billion dollars in tax revenues.

Is willing to do it wants and how reform -- spending cuts.

But the president is focused on the tax rates -- we makes it very easy for everyone to stay in their positions.

Right now and and I think if you put the president's plan house or senate floor it would fail.

Deal or No Deal deal.

Deal -- no idea what he -- I say -- I -- we'll have a deal John Boehner is making these for the president because.

His idea of compromises no compromise all he's gonna have to move and the Republicans that conference are going to happen.

So chill out Internet there's going to be -- -- -- Smart capable automotive below is the editor caucus come forth.

-- Yeah.

Good job well.

Happy Chanukah Merry Christmas advance Merry Christmas Kwanzaa -- boxing day but I have -- good all of that is please -- okay Internet.

Let's take care of some business shall -- Johnny sage says I'm seeing it stacked a distinct lack of good -- today -- Apologies we're gonna try to get Steve -- in here as quickly as possible it that's like that's -- like to go to use my tank is upset today.

Charlie -- -- Charlie Rangel about the taxpayer protection pledge of Grover Norquist group they made those pledges to us the voters that put them in office voluntary taxes.

Is he -- there is nothing voluntary about taxes -- at least not fun anyway.

-- -- hunt with Jonathan Hunt is up next which I know you enjoy.

But let's have.

Some PowerPoint -- its -- -- good medicine for you Internet.

Two days where points are and reserves.

So you know the Federal Reserve is doing.

Probably not because we don't notice because they talk very quietly and they sort of do stuff -- -- -- -- did what.

And the did what this week is that they are going to until the unemployment rate just rate -- six point 5%.

Make up 85 billion.

There's so much peace and -- treasury bonds and home and mortgage equity -- -- That's a lot of money -- making it up and they're putting it out there now they say they can handle the inflation that they acknowledge.

Would -- But it's making some people kind of nervous I think -- I think I just saw Rand Paul heading for the exists with some -- -- -- So here's the second point.

Central political issue since the founding of the country the idea of the Central Bank has been a contentious and controversial one.

And we need to think about this so here's -- third point who's in charge.

We need to know more about Federal Reserve they've tried to open up more but we need we need to know more about what they're doing -- taking this unprecedented policy role don't you think Internet I do.

And now as we like to do every day we want to leave you with the word from our French -- Us I mean you start by saying they're asking us every day.

For a daily update on the cliff is like covering every day but tortoise ten K you know -- yeah.

Tony say -- advanced than that claims will -- other -- -- gonna -- show.

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