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You're the commissioner who is responsible you conducting the investigation who was responsible.
I don't have an answer I tell you why don't you have that I that I was originally -- -- anybody yes -- -- and -- address.
I -- don't have that name either.
I'll be glad to provide those names and let him answer the question.
-- like Washington State's time.
I asked the senior technical advisor.
And and what's the senior technical a technical advisors name Nancy marks and what do Nancy tell you who's responsible.
I that I don't remember -- -- -- you don't remember again.
Who was responsible.
Simple question asked repeatedly.
Of the acting IRS commissioner this morning no answers provided.
Pursuing questions on this long before any -- were paying attention to it.
Because he had many clients who -- saying.
I'm being harassed by the IRS with questions wanting to know -- any member of my family is ever gonna run for office just because I'm applying.
For a status as a social welfare.
Organization I want to pick up where where we just left off.
Who was responsible he could barely get him to say that he talked to Nancy.
-- a Nicky told who's responsible but he can't remember at all what.
Well I've got the names of who -- the agents involved in this I don't know why they're having such a difficult time determining this because they all sent out letters Megan and I've got him because I've got when he seven point I've got import different offices so we know the agents' names they know the agents' names they know the supervisors names they know the group managers names I've I've -- -- my first job out of law school -- and -- counsel's office of the IRS.
I was a trial attorney.
In a regional office our client was the tax exempt group this is nonsense Miller's testimony was embarrassing.
Of course you know through this is and how -- -- -- or is still in charge of the Irish tax exempt has anybody asked that question this why.
Grill there this is the group that -- that oversaw directly.
The unit determinations unit so called in Cincinnati that was.
Giving -- was such a hard time and get that group answered ultimately to allow us.
Right and she still has her job.
And the performer the person -- -- -- job before her was -- -- when he ten when this criteria was developed she's now heading up the Affordable Care Act provision of the internal revenue -- -- are.
Our veterans service requirement she's now the agent about a person in charge.
So the person -- are so the first is Sarah calling -- who we believe was the one overseeing this program while it was being carried out -- -- -- against the conservatives has now been affect.
It is effectively been -- in -- and placed in charge of the Obama care obamacare unit yeah.
Responsible for dealing with people's information so that's a little chilling.
And lowest learn -- let's talk about her because she got a lot of press today.
Why hasn't she been fired because they -- they accused her of repeatedly lying to congress they said -- testified to them.
Recently this it came before congress on May -- Wednesday may eighth and was asked in part about these items that we've -- you know that the IG was investigating.
Didn't say anything about them didn't offer any truthful testimony on those subjects and then two days later on Friday -- Now they've admitted -- -- a question at a public event is that she was attending.
And had I had somebody ask her about it and then -- does it all yet we did that but he didn't do -- any malice and that -- -- Yeah it's not part of -- also said these are weren't inserted Miller today.
That this -- -- partisan activity it's just we're looking at what the positions these groups advocated work with some pretty partisan to me but that's about as good I thought you were fantastic yesterday.
When the president made his response to a question.
By not answering that question when it came to does anybody at the White House know about this before the White House counsel was.
Let noticed that the end of April April 22 and -- president -- let me specifically answer the question and he says nobody I didn't know BIG report until the IG report was released which was not a question the Bloomberg reporter asked.
-- this is really getting bad the president issues his request or response which is.
A troubling to say the least coming from the commander in chief of the United States -- the -- -- present our Chief Executive Officer that you got the head of the -- can't remember anybody's name.
And the person that's and charged with tax exempt it's still in charge of tax exempt.
Even though she oversaw this disaster which includes an attorney -- -- states may well include criminal activity so hadn't even -- the inspector general say they have to take a new book.
At the criminal activity aspect of this which they did not differ report.
Then that you've got this scathing letter that ms.
Lerner received from -- -- other members of congress saying you came you came up here repeatedly.
And provided testimony and asked to us that we just do not believe was true we think -- -- let us repeatedly.
And they said especially troubling is the fact that in June 2011.
Nearly a year before you provided answers that we now believe were -- leading to this committee.
You were briefed on the fact that there was a be on the -- memo within the IRS pretty conservative or Tea Party sounding groups.
And and -- instructed that that be changed but what we asked you about it it you you didn't mention about it -- disclose it.
He didn't tell anybody and that's how Miller sounded today to that he had been old.
But he refused to testify about it when asked by the congress it's like the IRS believe debate -- tell congress about it it would somehow go away.
Yeah well you know be on the lookout list of pretty directed targeted to me by the way.
Miller said today they acting commissioner now leaving his office three weeks earlier than it was clinics that -- -- -- Revelation by the president.
He said he does he objected to the we're targeting will be inspector general -- not because he used at least sixteen times inside of their report.
How with regard what the iris is -- and targeting in and of itself is partisan you're going after a particular.
I think that that's I want to ask you gonna tell us.
I want to ask you about -- Medicare you have a cousin coming up on break but here -- bit but the inspector general testified today he didn't say look this -- -- political he says at this point.
We have nothing to contradict the IRS's assertions.
That it wasn't political but he also admitted this wasn't a comprehensive investigation this was just an audit basically he performed.
And there seems to be another investigation going on right now but I want to ask you about this.
If this was not political if these groups were not chosen for political reasons.
What other reason could there be -- Did you take any steps when you -- -- that.
I don't ever call -- I don't.
I don't call through back and then there.
So you didn't inform the inspector general of that or your superiors that you recollect.
I'm not sure why would have to notify these these superiors it was -- in the papers.
I don't remember whether we made a referral -- word I made a -- at that time.
There that the IG again testified not that this was not political but that he had nothing at this point to contradict the IRS's assertions to him.
That this was not based on political reasons so I ask you Jake.
If this was not the targeting of a conservatives.
Repeated targeting over a period of eighteen plus months and -- it resumed.
Later -- -- two years for a rounded up.
If it wasn't for political reasons what other possible reason could there have -- -- Of course it has to be political because look who was targeted.
-- you had conservative organizations Tea Party groups patriot groups.
A conservative Jewish organizations -- Street because of their position with regard to Israel which was contrary to what the president's position what could you imagine if this came out say September of -- last year before the election.
That the IRS -- specifically targeted individual conservative organizations and have leaked information.
To some of those organizations opponents in courtrooms.
That in of itself is criminal activity.
So and I got here -- anything yet.
Yeah I know but -- -- No heat no he -- say that it it was not -- yet -- -- outrage be shocked shocked well I'm a little shocked that they targeted you know conservative groups although after doing these cases for 24 months nothing shocks me anymore.
And -- the inspector general's of one that used the -- targeting by the way.
So I think the reality is making this is nothing but.
Politics but there's Chris I believe that the attorney general saying that he's -- look at the criminal aspect of -- it's fine.
But -- you've got the FBI investigating the IRS.
And in the meantime let me just say.
I still -- ten clients that are waiting for -- exemption.
And we sent the letter on Monday to the -- acting commissioner and to the chief counsel's office Anthony's agent saying -- -- the exemptions already.
No response so next week we go to federal court this.
This is about now this was you know one congressman -- and Brady talking about what what one of his constituents went through but we you know you heard him saying is this still America.
When he said that his client.
Applied for tax exempt status in December of 2010.
And then I'm sorry in July 2010 which is just months after this whole thing was -- it was in full -- by July 2010.
That she she gets and visited by the FBI terrorism unit.
For FBI inquiries unscheduled -- by OSHA ATF two times she'd never been audited before.
I mean now that that's that's his allegation based on what his constituent told -- but.
Mean if that is true.
And this goes much deeper and much higher and gets to a much more disturbing level than we know today.
If we get the terrorism unit looking active in a potential Tea Party tax exempt individuals and harassing them requesting them.
But they didn't bother to put you know follow up on the first ball Boston bomber when he went over to Dagestan.
That tells you something but I will tell you this -- and I got a case right now.
We're a client challenged the HHS mandate and -- health care part of obamacare.
We've got an injunction on it he was audited for years ago or three years ago no changes everything was fine for a fairly large company.
After we got the injunction surprise surprise new -- -- -- again they got audited so I'm hoping that this is mere coincidence but at this point I assume nothing -- incidental.
And the fact is we are learning today.
Of many organizations conservative organizations not only that -- either slowed up in the process of getting their exemption but those that already had it were audited.
And not extensively during the same period of time 20102011.
To air -- -- they're good friend Billy Graham Franklin Graham said that to.
Their defense seems to be he said in his opening statement Miller did -- we made mistakes.
And then he admitted to abuses but he said we made mistakes.
And they he said look we it was 2010 we were getting an influx of applications to be -- this tax exempt organization -- -- -- to qualify once you for.
And so we had to have some way of dealing with all of them.
But I want to point this out because there is another piece to this.
We were getting a lot of complaints about said organizations.
And whether or not they really were political that's what the IRS said I've got it right here.
In the IG report in their response to the IG they said.
We also received numerous referrals from the public media watchdog groups and members of congress alleging that specific section -- -- once -- organizations.
Or engage in political campaign activity to an impermissible extends -- askew.
To what extent do we look to.
In particular those -- the democratic side of the aisle who were who were trying to light a fire under the IRS to go after these groups.
But Chuck Schumer.
Ask for these kind of reviews and they got -- -- -- don't like the result because the harassing now is acknowledging and apologizing.
For what they call -- pot for customer service that I what it's like returning an item to JC Penney or -- I mean give me a break.
This is a customer service if you follow -- return.
With the IRS you don't get to say I'm sorry you go to jail so this is this whole thing is is absurd it is politically motivated that's becoming clear by the moment.
And as more of this becomes.
Under light I think it's been it frankly Megan.
We probably just not even scratched the surface of what was going on by the way in 2010 applications for -- once seaports look at the IG report were actually down they put this in place before -- was quote the surge.
Of applications and if there was a surge of applications.
Ask questions that are relevant to the determination of status not what books you read -- -- your membership -- who donate -- money and have you ever thought about running for political office or anybody in your -- ever thought about that.
You raise a good -- start you raise a good point about what the IRS dusted the normal American citizen when.
They find themselves in the IRS cross hairs and that was appointee very eloquently -- one of their congress and we sought today.
With led to applause.
On the house the committee floor we will show that to our viewers in just a minute.
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