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And -- in the charge against the government's sweeping surveillance programs senator Paul -- the snooping -- all out assault on the constitution.
Griff Jenkins SN SA Director General Keith Alexander -- -- the criticism.
He's -- critics like senator Rand Paul and others that say they have what you're doing violates the constitution in his new reaching the government.
Good -- -- for everybody everybody has a difference of opinion about.
I just tell you that the courts the administration and congress all of.
Is a general -- are good enough senator Rand Paul joins us nice to see senator.
Good to see -- -- Nice to see users so are you satisfied -- that with the response by the general.
Well I think you're questioning gets to the crux of the problem.
Is the court order constitutional.
Is it constitutional.
For the court to take records without the permission of the individual without a judge's warrant targeted towards an individual.
My reading of the Fourth Amendment is is that our person and are things.
Are ours is only a judicial war on probable cause can take them.
Now some of the courts for years have said how would you give your records to a -- a phone company though law no longer years I disagree with those decisions.
And I think they need to be revisited particularly in this digital age so.
Technically yes they did get a court order technically yes some people in congress approved of this.
But really it wasn't widespread and they also lied to congress and said.
They were taking lots of it -- millions of bits of Americans ever ration.
Turns out they were taking billions.
Of phone call records on a daily basis so that blind test is really developed a credibility gap on their part.
I converted to the credibility could add depth I'm curious -- you say that the Supreme Court can be -- on the constitution.
Or are they the last word and we have to accept it as gospel.
Well you know I think most of us believe Dred Scott was wrongly decided.
I think most of us believe plessy vs Ferguson was wrongly decided so I think yes we do overturned things after -- -- when you get a different court.
A different understanding maybe the constitution and also maybe a difference in the technology -- how much information is stored by a third party users.
I've always felt.
All that the records that you have when they're being held by third party are still your records are still your papers and they deserve the Fourth Amendment protection.
-- you mentioned the line to tires I assume what you meant specifically correct me if I'm wrong is -- James clapper -- response to senator wyden's questions.
It back in March -- so my question is should he resign.
If he doesn't resign should the president fire him if the president doesn't firemen what's a statement to us.
Well the thing is is the president's really hurting in a big way right now I think he's losing the moral authority to lead the nation because.
We have the IRS scandal many targeted fox reporters and AP reporters that Ben Ghazi investigation no one was fired.
And now we have this new -- where his Director of National Intelligence.
Looks at the senate and says I'm not keeping our collecting any Americans information.
And it turns out it was just a bald faced lie.
And so yes I think he's lost his credibility I don't know how -- can regain his -- cape.
His credibility when he lied outright to congress and it's frankly against the law so no I think we need a new director of national intelligence and I think that.
The longer we keep him on board along when the president keeps him on board.
The more it's going to sap the president's moral authority.
-- two points one is it that you have been quoted as -- Edwards noted that the similar to a Civil Disobedience in the United Kingdom mart with a K and a second thing -- Vice President Dick Cheney has come out and grin that disagreement with you about this whole surveillance.
I responded both of those.
-- you know I think what you see there been polls is as -- is this week asking the American people what they think.
The vast majority of people agree with the media NSA's gone too far.
President's gone too far and that we do have a right to privacy even if you polled just Republicans well over 60%.
Agree was needed government's gone too far -- looking at all of our phone records.
As far as whether or.
-- -- is a hero or whether he's a scoundrel.
In a history's gonna decide that.
But I think he's risk his future and his career.
Over something that is say.
A belief a belief that our records are protected that we do have a right to privacy.
So you can see how many by judge that is being noble to risk everything you have for something you believe in.
You think of Henry David Thoreau who wouldn't pay one dollar not because the dollar was too much but because he didn't believe in the fugitive slave law.
So yeah I think there are ways to look at what he did and say yes this is an -- a noble.
Thing that he tried to do.
I think you could also say well gosh if he reveals secrets about somebody hurt that would be bad.
And the way I like to decide divide this issue is that if he had released a computer code that showed how we tracked.
People who would attack us that I think would be a betrayal of the country.
But he was simply released information about a program that have been reported by the New York Times.
That we came back to congress on in congress did vote I didn't -- about it.
But the majority of congress did vote to allow -- authority to occur.
So I'm not sure you could say it was exactly a secret the ACLU had another website that we were going to billions of phone calls before this happened so.
I don't think he endangered anyone and I think he's trying to do what he felt was right in his system of the constitution.
And the vice president disagreeing with him.
It wouldn't be the first time he made a mistake.
Hi I now the -- the new republic -- data ahead here on the cover and you let crossing your fingers.
And then that you've come back in your FaceBook page and really have been a smack down back -- no republic what's good out between you and the newer.
But we actually just thought it was kind of funny and you know -- I think wanted to insult me obviously -- -- I was got a -- So we're doing a poll on our FaceBook now and ask how we should respond.
And why did I have my fingers crossed was it because I was saying.
I love the new republic and that was maybe not the truth or that I trust of the president and maybe that wasn't the truth.
So while our people are having a lot of fun with that coming up with reasons why my fingers might have been crossed.
Under your -- then -- get done jab guys wonder members of congress that MI it's jammed a little bit we in the media get jabbed.
You know most the time I can take it well I think if it's a personal attack on my character.
If if someone wants to accuse me of judging people not according to their qualities and saying -- -- judge people and any other way that's very hurtful.
If they want to come after my family that's hurtful but if you -- make fun of me or do anything according to issues or say they oppose me.
I think I've got pretty thick skin.
Senate thank you I -- is -- there.
Thanks for him.