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Now on the growing crisis in Egypt reports -- more deadly violence in the streets of Cairo.
Dozens and dozens of people dead now when military troops opened fired.
On a protest led by pro -- supporters and deep south -- this so little sketchy at this time both sides call for more demonstrations across the country.
-- or anything the United States can or should do right now.
To the violence to get some more stability there -- -- -- a former senior director of Middle Eastern affairs.
At the National Security Council so my police say one of the ways to solve this or at least begin to try to calm all sides.
It's to get the very people that were forced out -- government.
Backing -- why.
Let's and I think that has to be the goal you know as and there are a lot of problems that president -- c.'s rule of Egypt's and not too many people I think in the west will sort of -- shedding a tear over his departure.
For the same time it was positive that the islamists were involved in politics -- opposed to being sort of outside in using violence which is unfortunately the road that Egypt may well -- on right now if you look at what's happening this morning.
And so I think you want those Islam is just like you want everyone else to be part of the political process.
Not be sort of outside of that process using other means to try to exert their influence its.
Any mention that reminds me of sending that Walter Russell Mead wrote today in the American interests let me just -- -- this could get hit.
State -- on a little further Michael -- he writes this is gonna send it in.
In power it whether it back in opposition in it can't regain its appeal their brotherhood knows how to survive under attack.
And a crack down we'll create new extremist faster than it can break down the old.
So he's making the point at the risk of not bringing these people back into the -- the the Islamist.
They just grow in more power but we have seen when it's what happens when they're in power Mike -- we did see that there was an -- the economy.
Their -- mass protests at the -- The forcing it is run into lots of sectors of the society that the other -- secular Egypt did not -- so how do you do with the right way is their right way.
But I I think general of the problem is actually much bigger even -- that which is that none of the parties in Egypt have articulated a plan for Egypt so.
You have secular opposition forces in the military for example what we know they don't like the Muslim Brotherhood we know they didn't like president -- But they haven't given any indication as to how they would get -- out of its economic problems and so I think what you want.
All of these different parties to do but especially the Islam is -- really transform themselves from street movements from opposition movements.
In the political parties that compete on the basis of sort of plans and ideas like you do in democracies.
And that I think is a test for the islamists -- they transform themselves.
From ideologues from people who sort of say well we have this philosophy of having Islam and politics.
In this something and it's much more like a political party that has a deal with the reality of governing.
And unfortunately I think what this -- is done is it's.
It's not really foresee is a mess to deal -- -- electoral defeat on the basis of having bad ideas which -- is what would have happened in the future.
It did using a mission as well that the opposition.
That indeed did not -- -- -- don't really have a plan I there.
Why why is that -- see that happening in and how do we provoke or help motivate.
Those platforms to come together so that there are some ideas and solutions out there.
But I think what's happened right now -- -- is that each side is kind of him is kind of focused on what they don't like about the other side.
As opposed to having -- to actually take on the difficult problems of governing and I.
Sounds like an American politics flyer doesn't -- -- -- if I -- -- are looking at the other -- how Kenny did this there's finance industries known can get along but you know that is the prom with democracy is a net.
But at the end of the day there has to be some sort of plan that the people agree upon.
Well I think that's you do because you make a fair point I mean you know you know luckily we're not going to the streets here in the United States or in other democracies and that's -- that's the kind of point of which maybe democracies.
Become mature when people will take -- I disputes of the ballot box as opposed to the streets.
But look I think you're right that there needs to be a process of -- that national reconciliation if there's going to be -- economic reform plan a constitutional reform plan.
These things are going to require the -- miss the secular parties and everybody else because it's not just those two factions.
To come together and find out where can they compromise where can they agree you know what.
What are kind of -- red lines and what aren't there red lines in order to move the country forward and I think what the west can -- with the United States can do.
Is try to use the leverage we have -- economic aid private investment and things like that to try to push all of those parties not just one to the other to do that.
You real quick -- thirty seconds but do we have any legitimacy.
They are now Michael considering what's happened over the last two years to to do the things that you sank.
Well I think unfortunately -- we've squandered a lot of our influence in the Middle East because we've been passive.
Because our positions have changed so much and because we frequently sort of not really taken account of what our allies -- -- what they need and so.
There's a very difficult thing as we come into this crisis and a very weak position not just vis a vis Egypt.
But in terms of our entire policy towards -- Middle East which is really just kind of a shambles.
Anderson while the rest -- -- also says that -- and -- life doesn't stop just because no one knows what to deal.
An interesting thought fresh today Michael always enjoy -- conversations thanks so much.
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