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Welcome to Washington -- James -- host of the fox -- broadcasting to you live here from the Washington bureau of Fox -- so good to have you with us here in the fox -- It could be forgiven.
For being a sentient adult who reads the newspapers reads the web.
Watches TV news and and and concludes.
That we live in a time of religious hatred.
So often we're hearing about Sunni Muslims.
Challenging -- -- Muslims and vice Versa.
Killing each other with conventional and -- -- means across the mideast we hear especially in light of recent events in Egypt about the ongoing persecution of Christians.
I've reported on that for Fox News just the last few weeks.
There's also another kind of religious hatred and perhaps the first ever.
The most ancient and enduring and about which today anyway.
Despite the vegetative control that users sometimes said to exercise over the media very little about.
Religious hatred of Jews persecution of Jews vilification and choose what goes by the ancient enduring name of anti semitism.
My guest today here in the foxhole joining us from our New York studios.
Is the author historian and my friend Daniel -- and author of the double -- never dies.
The rising threat of global anti semitism Danny thanks for joining us here in the -- today.
Thanks -- -- nice to see you again.
If only by satellite so.
This -- strikes me as -- kind of a status update.
All -- for something that has existed since time immemorial my right about that.
That's certainly right and anti semitism is really back.
And it's back in the forceful and most dangerous way.
Which is not appreciated by Americans because as it happens and for a click -- reasons United States is the exception in the world.
The only place really outside of Israel or Jews or -- -- secure.
And I never thought of as members of the national community and -- for don't feel threatened so it's much less in evidence here which makes Americans American Jews and non Jews both.
-- out there.
Mean rather easy going about the nature of anti semitism when in fact it's extraordinarily dangerous.
All over the world want to -- all over the world I mean all over the world.
Bullets -- there for second what about Canada or Jews threatened in Canada to any significant degree.
They're candidacy is almost tolerant countries in the world to kind of provide many more tolerant.
America a few more telling United States.
The incidence of the incidents of attacks upon Jews hate crimes and other kinds of attacks upon -- in Canada is roughly.
Thirty times greater than against the group which is seen to be the greatest victim of such persecution which -- as Muslims.
And so right there that tells you that the atmosphere is -- if we talked to Canadian Jews and you go to -- you find that the Canadian Jews are much more.
Likely not to want.
Have their -- -- known not to want to parade their identity is or have very that is being known because.
There's a great deal more danger.
Very different -- and that's nothing compared to where what it's like in Europe let alone in the Muslim world.
Broadly speaking Danny.
What is the state of modern anti semitism how does it compare to the great ages of the past whether the World War II period or.
-- the medieval dark ages or the inquisition or what's the state of the relative to.
Periods of the past.
-- -- three eras of anti semitism the first is the religious Arab.
-- christianity and by Islam.
The second is the modern era era -- semitism which was social Darwinian in its thinking that -- -- biological people and -- had -- Worst expression and -- most catastrophic consequences under the Nazis which who produced the Holocaust.
And now we've had this third -- of any of -- which can be called global anti semitism.
And each -- has different demon knowledge about -- has different accusations.
Has different means of transmission and and today not surprisingly in a globalized world anti semitism has gone global and that's mainly what my book is about about the nature -- semitism today.
And won't define for us global anti semitism -- -- what what is its distinctive character portraits.
It's distinctive character.
Portraits are Manning.
First it is -- found everywhere in the world in the past anti semitism was localized if -- broader areas in the local regions and Christian -- born Muslim lands today.
You -- anti semites everywhere in the world and Brazil and China and Japan not to mention Europe and Egypt and so on.
So that's one thing second you find that there and has -- flows going in every direction.
What happens in Europe it was what it takes place in the middle these Phillies with regard to their -- of Jews and vice -- this is different from the -- Third in criminology has changed for before Jews who were manifestly week.
Had no country no army were deemed to be manipulators pulling strings behind curtains.
Seducing behind us seducing young women is -- on this kind of thing today Jews are seen to be tough.
Violent Rambo like -- -- of of the past has morphed into Rambo the president.
And finally close the go ahead finish -- 10101 other thing anti semitism interest winds north -- domestic and international component.
You blame the Jews next door for poison your wells and all he worried about international jury.
In the past that is until very recently.
Emphasis has always been on the local Jews poles worry about for the local posters -- -- German -- and so -- now it has shifted the international realm.
We're we're most anti -- outside the Islamic world don't make these.
Charges against the Jews have their own countries but looked -- American Jews and Israel -- in the international realm wreaking Havoc in their view.
As a source of the great.
Of -- great danger and of the need to curtail them.
It Danny I would imagine that for Jews around the world.
The period of the final solution.
And the formation of Israel.
Represented -- kind of stark dividing line.
-- before all Jewish history that -- it and all that that that extends beyond that period and so I wonder if you agree and if you it's regard.
-- the Holocaust and the formation of Israel.
As decisive in shaping this new global anti semitism you're talking about.
Think there's quite interesting the Holocaust is who it was an event -- series events and which Germans and those are helping kill six million Jews.
Utterly powerless people the weakest people in the world essentially at that time slaughtered.
And yet after the Holocaust the demon Knology persists that Jews are incredibly powerful pull the strings.
Different countries is that -- brought the US Britain and other places.
And so it's quite surprised -- that anti semitism it is both surprising and not surprising if you know of the depth of the anti terrorism that it has made a comeback.
And the same kinds of accusations -- and it's important to point this out because many people who attacking Israel which is where you're also asking about.
To -- Israel as being a kind of -- country -- it has nothing to do with -- it's all about Israel but in fact.
Survey after survey shows that age old anti Semitic charges are men are believed by.
Hundreds of millions of Europeans.
-- a holocaust while it tempered and conservative for a while.
By no means to educate people about -- dangers is officially so and so made a comeback and -- to the second part of your question.
It has shifted its focus -- -- Israel has nothing aggravate people who dislike or have.
Just like Jews who hate Jews -- think that there's a country.
Where Jews -- -- of their majority of the country and it's a powerful country a regional power project power militarily -- powerful.
And this would will that's the biggest of the world as much as anything that exists in the world.
You mentioned and we should mention by the way that if you want to send.
Author and historian Daniel golden -- and author of the double that never dies your questions or any questions for me.
You can log in right beneath my face in your screen here unlocked off foxnews.com use your FaceBook or Twitter account to send us your shot and -- last enabled again.
-- your questions you mentioned earlier age old -- these.
Against the Jews I'm gonna read a passage from your book that I think.
You -- to open up your book and I think our our viewers and listeners will find striking you write on page five of the double that never dies released on September 3.
The counties against Jews have been the most damaging kind.
And then you go on to list.
Some of the ancient and enduring beliefs about Jews that are particularly pernicious to -- Jews have -- God's son.
All Jews and their descendants for all time in other words all Jews forever are guilty.
They are the enemies of god.
Jews are in league with the double -- desecrate God's body the host.
Jews -- -- the -- Jews seek to destroy his church.
Jews themselves are demons are devils.
Jews -- to -- God's Prophet Mohammed.
Jews are the enemies of all all Jews killed Christian children and use their blood for their rituals.
Jews kill Muslim children Jews -- financial Havoc in the countries in which they live.
Jews have started all wars.
Jews corrupt the moral fabric of society -- -- -- non Jews astray in every conceivable way Jews poisoned wells Jews Hindus and -- non Jewish women.
Jews are sexually like -- Jews are behind prostitution.
Jews are all criminals Jews are fundamentally dishonest Jews form an insidious international conspiracy.
Jews are fifth columnist betraying their homelands during times of war and peace Jews control the media.
Jews corrupt art and culture Jews are like vermin rats strangling -- -- festival clients you everything you say is alive.
Juicy to dominate nations.
Jews seek to destroy nations juicy to enslave humanity Jews are behind the presentations of capitalism Jews are behind communism Jews run the Soviet Union.
Jews do not contribute anything positive to society Jews do not do productive -- labor Jews already race apart Jews are genetically programmed to be malevolent.
Jews are highly intelligent and -- making them very dangerous enemy.
Jews invented aids Jews are responsible for 9/11.
Jews control the United States -- -- the Iraq War Jews are responsible for the financial meltdown of 2008.
Jews you conclude -- -- vanguard of the west to enslave Muslims and destroy Islam.
How pervasively are those things believed around the world.
Well we have a fair amount knowledge about what it's just in Europe.
But before -- answer question let me just say that the catalog of accusation against Jews which have been historically -- -- -- -- today some of them are very widespread.
Show us how fantastical a divorce from reality that charges charges -- They're not this is not the kind of run of the mill prejudice -- which we may be all familiar against lots of groups.
Jews have been accused of all kinds of things -- absolutely nothing to do with the reality of it is if the people are hallucinating or saying these things.
But they weren't this was part of the culture of the past and part of the culture the president so that they've been disseminated from.
Fathered -- -- mother to daughter.
In schools it is in communities in schools systems and that's why they're so widely believed.
Denny we we have our first viewer shadow wanna get to lost in Maryland says anti semitism I held -- anti semitism and anti christianity.
This will bring the discussion full circle back what's going on in the entire Middle East and especially in Syria.
-- can you address Danny has a historian of this and and someone who studied this particular former bracing for excuse me religious hatred.
Whether it is more prevalent in the Middle East then the persecution of Christians right now.
We don't have very good data of course Christians are being persecuted as fairly large minority group servers or -- -- groups and certain countries and most notably.
In the news lately in -- job.
-- simply don't exist in most Muslim countries anymore they're used to because for a million Jews.
In the Islamic Arab world and as a consequence of founding of Israel most of them worked Felder had to leave me some of them chose to leave.
So that most Islamic countries in the Middle East are effectively devoid of Jews.
They have achieved with regard to -- what Hitler sought to achieve in Europe with regard to do his.
That is have countries without -- -- them some Christians are persecuted are persecuted by political islamists.
And are in great danger and we should we should be you have total solidarity with -- we -- do whatever we -- Toronto.
Raised -- -- Can notify people to let people know about this and also intervene to help them.
We have we have about done with 35 seconds left in this part of our show before we take a quick break and come back with -- -- -- but I want to ask.
The author of the -- that never -- the rising threat of global anti semitism what -- The Arab Spring.
Which we've seen of course embodied all these protests in -- -- square and the ongoing Syrian civil war and upheaval in Libya in Tunisia and elsewhere what has the Arab Spring meant for anti semitism.
Well it's interesting that on everything on every side of the conflict people are accusing Jews.
Malfeasance and -- malfeasance minor fractures and -- have almost nothing to do with what's been going on and furthermore it shows -- line that those who attacked Israel.
Have been putting forward namely that Israel as a source of disorder in the Middle East that Israel is the problem -- because of the source of stability in the Middle East.
Credibility whatsoever in their attacks.
To -- -- does not the occupation of territories from 1967 -- by the Israelis.
Festering anti semitism in the mideast today.
The anti terrorism is -- complex phenomenon is so far as that there are these longstanding prejudices and patriots.
Which then get exacerbated an inflamed by a real conflict with Israel there is a real conflict between Palestinians and Israelis and you and -- -- countries and Israel.
So there's no doubt that that has.
Activate anti semitism intensified a given and given.
Provided for too many new accusations.
From which may -- be true about Israel.
But that doesn't explain why -- -- -- his services and if you listen to ask congress for all of the head of Hezbollah Hezbollah he made it clear what he's had.
When he said that Jews are despicable and weak and cowardly the most despicable people in the world and he then made a point hadn't noticed I do not say the Israel -- He -- I mean this -- a paraphrase of course because I say that word -- I'm speaking about Jews in general and not about is really respect.
And Michael Hagan.
We are gonna take -- quick break right here.
We're joined by Danny -- -- historian and author of the double that never -- the rising threat of global anti semitism gonna take a quick break.
We'll be back with -- right after this -- in the -- stay with us.
Welcome back to the foxhole and James Rosen broadcasting to you live from the Washington bureau Fox News so delighted to be with you here -- locked -- foxnews.com.
You're back in the fox hole in our guest is -- -- -- The historian and author of the double that never -- the -- -- threat of global anti semitism.
-- -- want to run through you with you a few quick subject so give me twenty seconds if you can on each of the following Vladimir Putin.
Obviously a power figure of extraordinary power in Russia over the past decade and extending into the future is he a force for anti semitism today.
-- how many forces frankly feminism today there's no point.
According to one particular politician.
What we should say more generally is that there is an international.
Sort of alliance is that promote anti semitism.
You mention the political.
Quality of -- feminism so.
Earlier and it is political in this way that is part of the farm policies of many countries and many others simply go along with it because it -- -- to do.
Let me let me strides in this got another way is anti semitism worst in modern Russia that it was under the Soviet Union or under Stalin.
Well you know it depends what what -- -- semitism and I'm sorry I can't give you such a -- answer -- There's there extended their beliefs that people have which is probably roughly the same as existed before.
And then -- actual persecution of Jews as Stalin actually was persecuting Jews.
And -- in in a variety of ways and Judaism as a religion was essentially forbidden in the Soviet Union so and that's as it was worse than.
It's it is quite there today that's quite widespread as it is in most of Europe.
-- case that you don't really dwell on in your book that I I thought she would.
Is that of the slain Wall Street Journal reporter Daniel Pearl.
For many people and certainly I think for four -- East Coast Jews here and in the United States and people involved -- the news media perhaps.
The killing of Daniel Pearl.
Kind of epitomized.
Their greatest fears about modern anti semitism what are your thoughts about the pro Cason and how symbolic is it really -- Well as you know I do discuss -- I don't dwell on your right right I want the striking things about Daryn good Daniel Pearl is how.
In pockets Don at this time how -- a minute.
Journalists who went there found the entire popular in -- -- -- came to contact with the even them tomorrow most moderate people weren't just from there.
And the killing of her all the -- him out in -- identifying him as a Jew.
As opposed having an American reporter or the many other ways -- -- you -- which you could see him.
As an indication of the nature of anti semitism and how murderous -- is anti semitism today not just in the hands of those who who.
Who killed Daniel Pearl.
But in the -- in the minds and the hands of hundreds of -- of people around the world is act that is elimination is or if you wanna call murderous and intent.
It is so violent -- imagery.
The violence and its aspirations.
You should -- in the book I can relate time and time again.
Where religious leaders people following them call in the Muslim blood -- way.
For the dismemberment of Jews for the -- of their eyes out for the killing of Jews for their extermination for the elimination of Israel.
It's worse in that respect than it was during the Nazi period.
The Nazis were much more circumspect in their aspirations even if they kill six million.
In the Islamic world that is in countries that are governed by political Islam.
It is open and murderous.
If anyone in this country heard anything of the sort that is routine and Friday prayers in the in the many Islamic countries if anyone heard.
-- -- sort of thing that about blacks or Latinos or Jews or Christians in this country.
They would be utterly horrified and we would declare whoever sent it to be the worst kind of racist and so on and the person being persona non Grata in the public -- And yet in these countries the leaders of these countries restaurant much at all.
Money shot and others say these things on a daily basis.
What is the greatest source of of anti semitism in the United States right now -- -- Such incidents.
-- there is a legacy of Christian anti semitism in this country.
It has been declining has been declining because a Christian churches including the -- the Vatican have come out strongly against anti semitism.
And so while many people still hold to the count me that Jews are all guilty for the death of Jesus.
The numbers are declining so there's this age old residue here it's simmering beneath the surface.
Aside from that and that is one of the things -- -- -- there are many different streams ready feminism may come together.
There's a great -- -- terrorism among the political after the liberal left.
Who see themselves as.
Is as pursuing.
Noble principles and international justice and see Israel as the great transgression -- oppressor Palestinians the great problem in the Middle East.
And they and college campuses and elsewhere are really fanning the plans ready semitism and create a cultural foundation and a grassroots anti Semitic.
Then the -- let me just sort of -- sense then there's -- there's a group of more right people not.
Not Republicans not Christian right as it has in the past and been discussed.
But more of foreign policy people who don't like America from policy and they want us -- vigorous work from policy and then and because they can't come -- And with the with the honest and and good argument.
They blame the -- -- to the Jews are behind.
Bill America's wars they're pulling the strings -- so forth.
Is there a famous right right of center person with whom you associate those -- -- Margaret -- John -- -- Stephen Walter though are the ones that wrote the book.
The book the Israel lobby.
And and -- they have been pushing this and and and there they have found.
They have found some willing here -- that's certainly true and and it.
It would have been hard to believe that a book like -- Twenty years ago would have even seen a lot of -- work on any attention but it became a big best seller and and produce a lot of ill will towards Jews and owned and argument to those of the book.
Repetition in dressed up contemporary garb of the Angel protocols and -- -- Lyon where there's as international conspiracy of Jews.
Pulling the strings are seeking to dominate the world.
-- I want to I didn't want -- let this -- go by without asking about.
Your first book and perhaps your most famous work.
Which is entitled Hitler's willing executioners ordinary Germans in the Holocaust which was -- what 1996 correct that's right.
This book -- -- internationally famous.
It was roundly panned by the sort of -- -- -- if you will of holocaust studies such as it exists in academia.
In the United States but it was an international best seller both in the United States and abroad and it.
I believe you were awarded a year the the equivalent in Germany of the medal of honor.
The highest civilian.
A distinction in that country four year study of the Holocaust.
Looking back almost two decades now what do you take away from the experience of having published that book.
The times we live in publishing industry.
The intellectual integrity of of your peers and reviewers and so forth what.
-- how did you emerge from all of that and -- look back on that experience today.
Well to begin -- The book.
Whatever some people -- at the time carping because the book actually overturn conventional wisdom and of course there -- many people in the academy who made their careers.
Putting forward -- commercial was and they were quite upset that a book.
Made such a splash which with the research and analysis show the what -- -- was wrong orders rove was right.
Was that the Germans were essentially willing perpetrators of the Holocaust those who participated.
And many others -- help because they were -- determined it.
As -- and since then the books assumptions and framework have won the day and the field is followed along -- so in that respect I'm very happy day.
And but what you find again and again and James you know this very well that when you.
When you go against the -- when you.
Overturned conventional wisdom as I do with a -- will never dies in many respects it is as.
Revolutionary for the understanding -- it -- semitism as it was willing executioners was.
For the study of the Holocaust when you do that a lot of people pushed back and they pushed back not only because of their career interest but also because he's a political issues.
And today you asked about publishing industry and media thought everything has politicized.
Anti semitism politicized people don't wanna hear about it they -- what did.
Third start of the Holocaust politicized as so.
I as -- Imus -- and I do do my job is to tell the truth as best as I can as I understand it.
Me I'm constantly responded to in political -- in political terms.
And what that's not the way the world that's and that's fine.
But we have to try to keep this thing.
Our analytical orientation.
And our attempts to make the best sense of complex phenomenon -- anti -- is.
And on the one hand and then our politics on the other.
They are -- talking about keeping politics out of scholarship and a sense and and critical review of scholarship.
Reviewer of Hitler's willing executioners.
Who I thought.
Voiced some legitimate criticism of the book and didn't really take -- to a political playing but analysts on his own terms -- -- fairly self.
And I say this is someone who's an admirer of your book I'm on record as an admirer of your book.
Was Richard rose -- a Pulitzer Prize winning historian in this country.
Written extensively about the birth of the atomic bomb.
And he wrote a book about the SS and some people taking issue with his own methodology -- that book but in reviewing yours he said that.
In essence I'm paraphrasing here but faithfully.
Gold -- assertion that the Holocaust happened because for the proceeding 200 years the nation of Germany and its citizens.
Had -- of their under the sway of -- progressively hardening anti semitism.
Which -- and labels elimination this anti semitism is to engage in scholarly terms in -- -- -- You can't tell us they they have tried to eliminate the Jews because they succumb to an elimination is theology if you will.
What is your response of that assertion that there's a -- volunteer work there.
Well there's not a -- at all it straight from the testimony of the killers themselves are getting over -- our primary search.
It about the killers including their own testimonies.
-- they gave -- from a German legal authorities and there was -- tell us how much they hated Jews.
It has nothing do with the policy has to do with the evidence and amassing the evidence I did as systematic probably study.
Did archival research.
Got their testimony.
And the results -- -- from being.
Well one is as one -- said speaking for all of the killers around him to -- was not considered by us to be a human beings.
If that's not anti semitism.
As they say I don't know what is and what is most interesting about the Holocaust -- represented feminism today.
Is that you had this powerful.
This problem or bigotry that was existing broadly in Germany and also many other countries in Europe and it lays dormant.
Underserved work conditions but then when -- -- came along and it's -- turn to state policy they easily activated.
And I found that many many many people were willing to kill Jews and torture them and kill children is -- on.
That's the danger of anti semitism is in -- thank you Christian ideology.
It that we see activated now.
And the Middle East as well which is prejudiced consumer -- surfers in the case of anti semitism there open and Ben Ben strident.
And when political courage to fight to an active program of killing which is what has happened again and again and genocide they can be.
They can be stirred up and move people -- -- director very quickly.
And in the Middle East -- could -- Jews it's happening as I said to some extent against Christians we must.
These are not just academic discussions these are very very very dangerous.
Ideologies and theology is that we're talking about.
Man's inhumanity to man one of the great scholars of it is Daniel Jonah goals -- -- is the author most recently just out this month.
Of the double that never -- the rise and threat of global anti semitism it's published by little brown it's available on Amazon.com we thank -- gold -- My friend.
And calling for visiting us here in the fox hole that's gonna do it for us here in Washington -- James Rosen tune in two weeks from today.
We'll see right here in the -- --