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-- is it isn't the nature of people who get into government.
That they have what our friend -- accustomed called the look vetoed -- -- -- -- -- left to dominate I mean but just just take a simple example.
Of medical savings accounts which work so well.
The companies that have them love them the people that receive them love the way they work.
But company puts money into your medical savings account you spend -- however you want the company buys insurance the value of the medical savings account.
Is that deductible on the insurance that you get the insurance with a high deductible which is very inexpensive.
And you have the money in the medical savings account but you get to spend that money.
In the medical savings account however you want you don't have that government.
Telling you how to spend it is the key to all of that's the fact that people in government.
Want to make decisions for us and don't trust us to make these decisions for ourselves.
I think that you know that gets for the novel a lot of things and I and I don't think it's because people are necessarily domineering but rather there also patronize him.
-- reason and and a long you know we in keeping with the kind of libertarian small a libertarian -- we don't talk about things in terms of left and right liberal -- conservative but rather are you in favor of more control -- more choice in in human flourishing and this gets to the nub of it even something like a medical savings -- which I think is a great leap forward.
In -- the ways that we would priced medical services and things like that.
Even that's too complicated I I don't think it's the government's role to say you know what certain types of purchases whether it's education or -- of medical services which -- the two big guys exemptions or retirement savings.
These are tax advantage these are incentivized because some -- there purer and better.
And more honorable.
Purchases that I -- things.
Let's just leave it open you know and and let doctors let insurance companies compete.
Come up with new ways of curing people new ways of keeping people healthy.
-- new ways of making people understand how they might live better and more fulfilling lives in terms of medical services.
Again you know this is something where in a nation where we have a coffee shop in a bar on every corner and you know twenty different hair stylists and every town.
No no matter how small.
We can afford to deregulate medical coverage and we will not see a decline of medical coverage rather we'll see -- flowering.
Of all sorts of delivery of medical services and also innovation I mean which is really in the end.
That's the main thing that's helping people live longer happier lives is is is medical innovation and most of the health care reforms that are on the table most of the insurance reforms.
Are going to choke off that kind of.
And of fatalism that -- features the government I'm gonna let you go on a second the government -- an -- in the in the post office delivers the mail the same way it did thirty years ago Amtrak runs on the same tracks.
That it ran on thirty years ago they they they don't I think there are going to -- assume.
I was gonna say I think Amtrak is still serving exactly the same sausage and -- -- that I had thirty years.
Or forty years ago -- -- -- sadly remember the days before Amtrak and taking the long branch New York railroad.
Up into Manhattan what you know this is this is exactly the point we don't expect the government to innovate the government is not it's a slow moving lumbering.
Ocean liner of a of an enterprise.
What we need is to unleash market forces.
It competent competitive forces and awesome the ability tapping into the decentralize knowledge.
As an individual I know what kind of medical care I want but I can afford.
And also I will I will.
You learn to understand new supplies new renovations in the same way that we see on -- -- In every other aspect of the economy -- -- is no.
No exception to that rule and you will certainly -- -- what you need and what you want and what you can afford them the federal government well nick Gillespie editor in chief.
A recent TV and reason dot com always a pleasure my good friend you're welcome back here at.
Looking forward to The Daily Show effect -- thank you thank you very much Jesse Kelly whose account for congress.
In the eighth district in the great state of Arizona and then tell.
And cool until not too long ago was wearing the uniform of the United States Marines joins me now.
Yes really welcomed the freedom watch thank you know it's a pleasure they -- an ex marine running for congress -- Clinton -- about 1 December 28 years old.
Well I love my country and I think you know if the defendant -- that though didn't come with an expiration date film going to do something about it right now we're going radically the wrong direction.
And I can't stand by and watch them watch Fox News in the -- the TV any longer it's time to get up get off your -- to go do something about it.
It's a government doing.
That it's going in the wrong direction you probably just turn my interview with congressman Paul with Peter Schiff.
And with nick -- suspect that you agree with much of what they said that if you had to put your finger on -- war three things.
That is really animated -- -- young -- -- with your military background.
To pose in front of an American flag.
What an M sixteen in your hands and say I'm not your everyday Republican I'm a serious Republican.
What what those issues like it would you're gonna try to limit me to two or three you could give way -- anytime you want and I want folks I know -- I didn't make it's not you really didn't pose for these political pollsters when an M sixteen and there's only you can't forget when you say.
Well that was the idea was that you can't forget -- burn that image in your brain I want to go to Washington to fight for the American people again that's what I want okay -- -- -- that you want -- wage we need to get this government way back on scale right now first the ball financially they are spending and taxing and spending us towards the edge of a cliff.
Were racing towards that -- instead of radically reversing course they talk about stimulus money.
So stimulus money is now a government takeover and borrowing money from future generations my son's ten month old.
And now he's buried in debt because of this congress in this presidency it's completely unacceptable.
-- you -- -- put 787.
Billion dollars back in the economy it's called tax cuts is these are things that are proven throughout history that will work.
Not government take over for the last six months the last long time.
Every single piece of legislation that comes out of Washington has expanded government power -- expand -- government spending.
What's in my mind is the wrong direction liberty and freedom of movement.
Is it is it something about people that get into government.
You'd be an exception Ron -- an exception was a judge in New Jersey I was an exception but is -- something about people that get into government.
That they think they.
Government knows best that they want to grow the government that they want to use the power of the government.
To control other people's lives and you remind me a lot more Barry Goldwater -- you do what John McCain I'm mentioning too.
With one of whom I agree on almost everything with the other won't migrate an almost nothing but they're both Republicans -- Arizona.
Well thank you I'm honored for the comparison.
But I just think it's the nature of man you've given that position of power and though most powerful legislature in the world how senate presidency.
And you feel -- you're in front of all the screaming crowds the cheering and you feel as if somehow you know best now.
And I just think you lose touch with the American people I've been to Washington DC before.
You can feel -- you can almost taste it there this feeling of power that they think they have when really that's not America America is the guy the lady who goes to work every single day comes home pays the bills trying to put two and have kids through college.
That's that's America.
As you go around the eighth district in Arizona what do you hear people saying are they the ones that we saw it in August.
Outrage that the federal takeover of health care the proposed federal takeover of health care.
Or are there are more local issues you -- to Arizona that are and the -- the people whose -- you see.
All the wanna talk about right now -- health care now the defense spending that 10% cut -- defense spending with a big when we have Raytheon there and that's the big employer over 101000 employees in my district.
But really all they wanna talk -- health care right now we have a large 65 and older population and they are understandably.
Concerned about President Obama or anybody in government taking over health care and then rationing the care they receive so that's all they want to talk about right now.
When you make arguments and use words like freedom.
Natural law which we'll talk about what our colleague in just a minute.
Our rights come from our humanity the government's principal job is to defend our freedom not to put bread and butter on the table.
I know you make these arguments because I've I've read your words in in in the blogs and and from people who follow you.
To those arguments resonate today yes.
Absolutely more so today than ever before because the government has grown and -- infringed on those rights more so today than ever before now with specially.
When you talk about freedom.
And people here president talking about telling them what kind of light bulbs and windows to keep in their house and you follow that up with a message of freedom and liberty.
That resonates that the American people with the ability to own your own labor that made America great not the federal government.
We are talking with former United States Marine Corps I guess once a marine always a green -- forgive me for said former sergeant Jesse Kelly.
Candidate for a congress in the eighth district in Arizona should -- be in Afghanistan today.
I wanna go to your other field of expertise -- I want full commitment I won't full commitment one way or the other either get the troops out tomorrow or fully fund -- it in -- I support victory in Afghanistan we were attacked from that country from people from an enemy who made Afghanistan their home 3000 Americans were killed.
By people who resided in Afghanistan I want victory I don't like the spending that we're doing now it makes it that much worse because of the big spending we're doing domestically but I support complete victory and a possible for a western nations.
And bring democracy to it or is there something about the history the culture the topography.
That makes it almost upon us why Russians -- next door in the Clinton -- well you hit the nail on the head we have a different mission in Russia did there but you hit the nail on the head it's about installing a democratic form of government and that is the difficulty there because that's purely a tribal nation.
If that can be done.
I want full commitment to a counseling that if -- cannot -- one out now I'm not in on those joint chiefs meetings I don't know whether it can be done or not I know especially as you mentioned the terrain is well.
It's such a divided nation by tribe.
It's difficult to a -- OK -- I want you to stay here -- election with Tom Allen who's the author of a return to common -- reawakening liberty in the habit in the inhabitants in America.
Tom this is your second appearance with -- welcome back to freedom watch yeah thank you -- -- benefit if the if the states amended the constitution to get rid of the First Amendment.
Would we still have freedom of speech.
Well of course -- mean we can never lose any of our.
And and the only question is will we have a system of laws of that are going to protect them adequately or not.
The constitution is great.
I've always said the constitution's not the last word the natural lives when when Jefferson wrote that all men are created equal.
And endowed by their creator with certain inalienable right -- emphasize creator and in nearly -- He -- in the American soul to the concept of the natural law that our rights come from our humanity.
So our rights come from my humanity -- my right to speak freely and you're right to disagree with me it's as natural as the fingers on the -- of our hands.
And if the framers recognized that when they wrote in the First Amendment congress shall make no law abridging.
-- freedom of speech and the -- about because.
I think that reflects their understanding that freedom of speech preceded the existence of the country how can congress right laws back and punish -- -- speak.
Right and you know one of the reasons I wrote my book was trying get across to.
The readers that -- there is an underlying principle here the natural law.
That precedes all government and we talk instead the arguments now are so far from that.
That we start to talk about our Second Amendment Rights are constitutional rights -- First Amendment right to free speech.
I don't like those terms because what we have in the constitution our protections we have a First Amendment protection.
As you say -- vote right to free speech which pre -- the government when people say.
That the right to speak freely comes from the constitution.
Well in -- again it it goes back to the philosophy I think you hit the nail on the -- our founders made a choice you know there were other philosophies available.
For them through to base our nation now and I mentioned a few woman a couple articles I've written there was that the philosophy of Hobbs who said that we had to give up.
All of our natural rights to an absolute monarch right where the security that that that absolute monarch could give us back and protect us from violent that.
And then there was Russo who said that we had to subordinate our rights to this general -- which I.
I don't think he ever really defined.
And then there are there was Locke who said that no you -- society to protect your right right and you have.
Aristotle I'm going in -- history Clarence Thomas Martin Luther King.
A number of people who sent our rights come from -- -- -- the government doesn't give us that -- the government's obligation.
Is to protect those rights correct and it says in the declaration of independence to secure these rights governments are instituted among men.
So there is no mistake about which philosophy.
We base our country -- -- we started -- I think that there was a very.
A definite shift at the turn of the last century where we said.
The purpose of government is no longer to secure our rights but instead is now to create economic equality to.
Spread democracy throughout the world make the world safe for democracy and -- and and that can only be done at the expense of the individual's right -- If if if you if you have no natural rights no respect for natural rights democracy could be two wolves and that she.
Voting on dinner -- guess who's going to become dinner right there is no match for rights to protect that sheik.
Which which is my objection to the notion that military force alone.
Can inculcate democracy.
Because just a simple majority vote.
There's only the tip of the iceberg of democracy democracy really needs.
That the individual is greater than the state but the majority can't take away the individual's rights.
Unless the individual has assaulted somebody else's actual rights.
-- you know it it really surprises me that the Republican Party.
Uses the word democracy so much to do it described the United States because they could say republic which would be good branding for them.
And there is very key difference no Madison called democracy the most vile form of government.
And the founders are very afraid of of democracy.
On the flattered because they thought it would be mob rule they thought it would be too -- to wolves -- to have the shape for dinner cracked you know.
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